Sparked by...
... particularly Olwa's question and comment about what happens. A lot.
Considering the change in attitude towards monster races (for the better, imo), I suggest REQUIRING goblins, kobolds, and other monster PCs to send a message to the DM channel if they enter Lower to keep the DMs alerted to the strong possibility of PvP.
I'd just say that goblins and kobolds need to be exempt from getting a DM, if you see them anywhere except-say the Crone-they can be PvP'ed. Part of playing a goblin or kobold is that you shouldn't be able to whine when you get whacked anywhere.
I think Oro's suggestion would be a step into the right direction.
Part of playing a goblin or kobold is that you shouldn't be able to whine when you get whacked anywhere.
And another is that you shouldn't be able to start whacking people the moment they go somewhere there isn't NPCs, only to run back and cry "Base!" in front of the NPCs when they try to get back at you.
I agree with Oro as well..the only caviat is no whineing if you get owned by what you assumed to be an easy mark monster pc...a goblin would kill, drag off and eat whomever attacked it. Can't speak to those weak, scaley things though..
Oroborous I'd just say that goblins and kobolds need to be exempt from getting a DM, if you see them anywhere except-say the Crone-they can be PvP'ed. Part of playing a goblin or kobold is that you shouldn't be able to whine when you get whacked anywhere.
Obviously some of you guys still haven't clicked on to the whole reason why PvP in Lower reverted to needing DM supervision again.
As much as I agree with Oro, the problem is that players do whine.
I've attacked goblins and kobolds just for being goblins/kobolds in the past. Yes, one did whine, a lot. "You're supposed to get a DM!" "You're not supposed to attack low level players!" It's hilarious what isn't in that journal!
So yea. sour losers are nearly as bad as griefers.
The original suggestion has nothing to do with whether people whine or not for being attacked as a monstrous NPC, nor does the issue of Dm supervision for PvP in Lower, monstrous or otherwise.
As for the suggestion, its impossible to enforce and moreover isn't desirable. It would basically mean playing a goblin would be impossible without constant DM supervision.
If you are a goblin PC and you're taunting other people, get a DM.
If you are a goblin PC and you're taunting other people
Problem is, this feels as if it is the perpetual state of all Goblin PCs. At least, with all those I've encountered.
As it is now, a goblin stands a better chance of surviving in Lower than a Spellguard Agent. To me, that takes away the reason to want to play a goblin to begin with.
//side note: Can I app for a goblin Spellguard agent?
What happens when character A attacks goblin B, but goblin B has a half-orc buddy who then wants to attack character A for attacking goblin B?
We tried this, basically, and unsupervised PvP issues led to DMs spending a lot of time trying to sort out issues after the fact. We didn't enjoy it very much.
That said, I am sympathetic and would like to find some solution that lets PCs be able to PvP appropriately without the nuissance of finding DMs which I understand is hard at certain hours of the day.
Howland What happens when character A attacks goblin B, but goblin B has a half-orc buddy who then wants to attack character A for attacking goblin B?We tried this, basically, and unsupervised PvP issues led to DMs spending a lot of time trying to sort out issues after the fact. We didn't enjoy it very much.
That said, I am sympathetic and would like to find some solution that lets PCs be able to PvP appropriately without the nuissance of finding DMs which I understand is hard at certain hours of the day.
Just seems to me, that if you START the PvP on the streets of Lower, you're automatically assuming that anyone who happens by will jump in. If you attack a goblin and his six half-orc buddies bum-rush you, again, you don't deserve the option to cry about it later. You threw the first blow.
I'm thinking just the streets, not Cyrus' bar which is clearly patrolled and protected from this kind of stuff.
If some people whine too much, yeah, obviously its not worth it.
I'd like to point out that it's not exactly fair to open up PvP -on- monsters without opening up PvP -for- monsters. Most of the time as a goblin I am content to let other folks start the fights, but there are situations when attacking is called for.
Like one character threatened four extremely tough goblins in the Pumphouse, saying "I'll be back in five minutes," implying of course that she went to get friends. We should have dropped her right then and there, but couldn't in the presence of Chuckling Bill and the absence of a DM.
edit: I guess I'm spewing hot air as it doesn't matter anyway...
Most of this is pretty irrelevant.
DM supervision for PvP in Lower is in because people couldn't play by the rules outlined for PvP on EfU.
Whether they are monstrous PCs or not is not an issue.