Cleric RP

[Gwydion]

It's certainly not my place to criticize someone else's RP publicly.  This is not intended at a specific character or player.

But if a character is a cleric, there should be some visible indication of the fact that that character is a holy representative of a god, wielding their mighty powers to serve the will and designs of that god.  Right?  Isn't that part of the onus of playing a pally or a cleric?  

Frequently the only indication I have of a party member being a cleric is that they are wearing armor and say, "Everyone gather around me".  Not even a mention of their god when they do this.  And it's frequently so meta-gamed when you are starting a quest, they don't even say why they should "gather round!".  

Shouldn't a cleric be asking other characters about their faith before they travel together?

As an aside, players of clerics should at least throw out some RP why a cleric is buffing two characters to the gills, and completely ignoring the rest of the party.  They are both followers of your faith?  Or is it because they carry swords and have the most Hp beside their portrait on the right of your screen?  A L8 Ilmateri cleric would be more likely to buff the L4 rogue who successfully lies and says he "shoots arrows for Torm" than the L8 guy with a great axe who smells and acts rude and says, "sure I'll accept Ilmater's blessings".  And look at all the RP this creates!  

With the religious conflicts of a multitheistic pantheon so deeply ingrained into the history and culture, it's terribly immersion-breaking to me to see the RP aspects of the cleric class are often completely ignored.  

I don't care if a character worships Shar, or Mask or doesn't want to portray their faith openly.  Then they should hide being a cleric at all, or RP that they are faking being a cleric of another faith.  

The RP of an arrogant fighter, a shifty "scout", and the overall "tough guy" schtick is everywhere, but when was the last time  you actually heard a cleric preach, talk about their faith openly, or tried to actively convert another character?  Those types of acts are a lot rarer than clerics on the server from my observations.

I'd suggest DMs temporarily strip the divine powers of these quiet buff lords who don't overtly represent their god - or have a real good reason why they are not.

[Equinox]

i believe dm's -do- do this.

i have worked closely with serveral clerics. many of them always preach which god is providing blessings. fewer publicly preach but i have seen sermons atop the ziggurat.

Battle clerics tend to make warcries based around their faith, and generally from what i have seen most clerics are pretty well rp'ed.

It also depends on how devout you are as a cleric, yous charisma affects this also. a 12 charisma cleric is less likely to openly preach the words of their gods and try to convert people than the 18 charisma guy who is clearly focused on this aspect of their "job".

just because you play a cleric. doesnt mean you have to be "in your face" preachy. it varies dependant on alignment, charisma, persuade skill even.

perhaps you have just been unofrtunate in working with a less rp-orientated cleric.

[Gwydion]

Sorry Equinox,

But saying, "Gather around for Helm's blessing" and "For Tempus!" isn't much IMO.  

Being "in your face" preachy I would think is pretty standard for a cleric.

You saw few publicly preach.  That's exactly what I'm talking about.  Isn't it standard practice for priests to preach?  Do they just sit around in bars hoping people hear about them and come to them?

If you play a cleric and already do these things - great.  If you witness good RP from clerics, send them a Tell how cool it is.  Personally I'm seeing the hardass role RPed well all over, but not much from most cleric characters.  

It's something lacking right now IMO.  Perhaps it's just when I play right now, but take this little test yourself.

Make a mental list of every notable cleric on the server, who they worship, and what they are doing to serve their god.

[IxTheSpeedy]

Eh, not sure that just spouting battle cries is enough.  A cleric is supposed to be a devout and divinely inspired individual, they are actually granted powers by their lord to basically create miracles...  Think about it, they utter a prayer and wounds are healed, or caused...  They can raise the dead, make you strong as a Bull...

It just happens that since this is a fantasy world, miracles are semi-commonplace.  People get used to them so we forget what they are actually doing, channeling the divine.

Depending on the faith, they don't have to throw it in your face but they should definately be mentioning something about their lord in every conversation at the bare minimum.  Think about a modern day priest.  Have you ever had dinner with a priest, or a Rabi, or a Sheik?  They speak about God all the time and most of them, as far as I know, can't heal wounds or summon fire elementals...

[Kiaring]

Because of the way the Realms are set up post 2d Edition DnD, the number of worshipers a God has directly influences that deity's power and ability to control things at their whim.

This is why Clerics, all Clerics, even Sharran and Maskarran Clerics, have proselytism as a huge role in their lives. I'm not saying that everything you do has to be related to winning over more adepts to your faith, but it's actually pretty close to that, in my opinion. The point is every God wants more power, and more worshipers, to be able to push their dogma and agenda. So I agree that, for example, offering blessings to people who 'accept' them isn't necessarily enough; Are these people followers of your God's allies? Are they open for conversion? Do they only want the buffs to crush in quests? Wizards are the ones who offer their spells with more freedom; Clerics, despite their unbelievable mechanical prowess on NWN, do carry quite a few 'onuses' that must be considered when playing one.

[Letsplayforfun]

Totally agree. Clerics shouldn't be buffers only. They should be gathering the faithfull, slaying the infidels, building temples, preaching the right and wrongs, etc.

It's probably out of line for us players to criticize other's rp, but, well... here it is.

There's probably a few deities who'll go a different way (Mask and so on), but the rest is pretty much standard in any culture (at least RL civilizations).

That's a real setting-coherence issue when there's an unlikely gathering of so many different faiths. Most kingdoms are structured around a similar pantheon of gods, with a few illegal one in hiding. But having so many opposed faiths walking around as if nothing mattered is really weird.

IMO, there ought to be one dominant faith crushing all attempts at opposed faiths to even show themselves.

But that's just me, myself, and i.

[RIPnogarD]

Just my opinion but gods like Shar and Mask don't mind if their priests lie and do things that make others question them.

A priest of Mask may say he’s a cleric of Ilmater and cast spells off kilter to make people distrust the Ilmatri and so on. These types of priest would not be out bible thumping their religion, they would be quite quiet about it.

[ExileStrife]

This will always be something that separates the good roleplayers from the great roleplayers.

That said, we hold much higher expectations for classes like clerics.  Have some faith in us.  Also, because you don't see a particular cleric preaching his or her dogma at that given time doesn't mean they never do it.

[Thomas_Not_very_wise]

I've played, many, many, clerics.

I know what you have to do to earn converts.

The thing is with most characters, people aren't open to conversion. They base a character around a deity, while there isn't a problem with this generally, it makes it hard earning converts the old fashion way, preaching. You often have to offer players something material for them to change faiths, and I am often frustrated by this tendency, because if someone is going to change faith, the common person has the intuition in that it should be a matter of faith, not wealth. You worship Waukeen because you -believe- in her message of wealth for those who work for it, you worship mask because you -believe- his ways of the sly best represent what is in your soul. And the Bane to every cleric is that you won't get converts if your message is directly opposed to their morals.

More often then not, people worship a god because this god is the patron of the trade, Gond for blacksmiths and Artisans, but the merchant will worship Waukeen of Shaunkandal. Escorts, male and female, those who offer the service in order to pleasure others, worship Sharress in thanks for giving them the gift of giving pleasure to others. Citing a few examples.

The Foundation of the Forgotten Realms is mostly made up of Neutral aligned NPC's. Very few of them are good, or evil aligned, and it is these NPC's that often make a difference in the world. The views of the Neutral NPC's aren't exclusive, they worship a god out of fear, such as umberlee, and give homage to her exclusively, doesn't mean he's evil. People who follow Malar often do so because he's the deity of the Hunt, and the ban on ranged weapons is kept to the clergy. They don't worship them because they are evil, they worship them because they make a living within their domain, and might be good souls. They simply might not of heard of Valkur or Nobanion as appropriate alternatives. This is why we have clerics, so people can LEARN OF THE EXISTENCE OF OTHER DEITIES, NOT ONE PERSON KNOWS THE NAME OF EVERY GOD THAT WAS OR IS IN EXISTENCE.

I was always confused on how racial deities should preach, do they try and garner converts among their own race, and then, this is even harder to do amongst humans. Halflings, orcs, and elves for example, often times pick a deity and stick with it thick and thin, and is often a source of trauma for the racial cleric, when he tries to convert his fellow hin, he's saying that Yondalla isn't what is right for you, it's Brandobaris, for example.


So, in the end, simply preaching won't cut it if you are after converts. People will listen, and subtly mock you for taking the effort. I preached many times with my Gargosian, and very few people appeared because well, everyone OOCly knew what garagos was about, and none considered what new twist I might of placed on it with my Gargosian. I did the same with Allivarn, He disdained using underhanded methods when Waukeen, and encouraged honorable business practice, as he called it, when in fact, often encourages merchants to do anything to get ahead.


It's up to the players to listen to clerics, people go, "Oh, cleric of Tyr, he's for law etc..." it never occurs to them that this Tyrran might of decided the law on the Colony is helplessly corrupt, and might secretly rally a rebellion against the government.

I will leave off with a single note: Clerics are among the hardest classes to play simply because YOU MUST PUT THOUGHT into the character. You cannot make a cleric of Oghma and power quest, this said cleric must have tangible work and must share ideas he or she comes up with others in order to pursue the idea, and might pursue a personal project. A Cleric of gond MUST have some sort of trade, a Cleric of Valkur MUST have sailing skill in order to be a cleric of Valkur, and must put in the effort in where he garnered these skills if asked. A character must have a reason why he turned to Cyric and became a priest, was he initially sickened by the acts of Cyric, but was power hungry enough to worship him anyways? Perhaps he wishes to change the Tone of the Cyrist Church into something less evil?


Clerics are endless possibilities limited only by the player and the Dogma he or she might step over. However, TALKING to others about their faith, why they worship, or lack of worship, and offering something your faith can exclusively give, is a good place to begin in creating a following.


Thomas|Rantout.

[PanamaLane]

There have been and always will be excellent clerics.

There have been and always will be poor clerics.

[Diagnosis]

Sorry, I'm a little confused.
What's this RP thing you're on about?