Illusion Theme Summon

Started by Spiffy Has, March 07, 2012, 02:20:13 PM

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Spiffy Has

Given the relative utility and usefulness of the Illusion Theme, I would propose the following changes:
 
Make the Second Circle Summon the first circle summon, and the first circle summon the second.
 
The theme is very useful, but as it seems, the "Summoned Light Sparks" seems a tad strong when compared to the second circle counterpart.

EveryoneIsAWinner

Or- Make the 2nd summon have AI which makes it not use its cone of derp when allies are infront of it.

Egon the Monkey

Or give it a selection of eyeball rays instead. That thing gets ragekilled more than Vomit Rats, which could also do with their Cone of Fail removing IMO.

Yalta

As I would hazard a guess that DM's are not keen to improve an already useful summoning theme...
 
Perhaps just give the first level ones really slow movement? Easy to implement and makes them less useful.

The Old Hack

Quote from: Egon the Monkey;277814Or give it a selection of eyeball rays instead. That thing gets ragekilled more than Vomit Rats, which could also do with their Cone of Fail removing IMO.

Egon is right. My immediate reaction when anyone summons the eyeball is to kill it before it buggers the party good. Mind you, I don't do it in rage, I do it in cold calculation as I just don't want to die.

Nihm

The Vomit Rat cone is just too funny to remove.  I hope it stays.
 
I think Illusion deserves a great level one summon as the next two are pretty bad.  Many themes have some good summons and some poor ones, with higher tiers sometimes being weaker than the one before it.

xXCrystal_Rose

Level 1 summons in illusion are pretty tough. The die quick though when they are hit however. Sure they're fairly strong offensively compared to other level 1 summons but I think in general it balances with the weaker illusion summons that come afterwards. I mean like, compare it to a level 1 fire elemental. The illusion will just obliterate it, but level 2 illusions are suicide for a group and level 3 illusions just lack both the punch and defence compared to a level 3 fire elemental. Just as a point of comparison between themes people should be used to.

LiAlH4

Illusion summons tend to be weak but atmospheric, in my experience. The higher level summons are without question some of the most fantastic that I have seen in the module!

No changes needed, from my perspective. Maybe replace that damned eyeball. :)

Egon the Monkey

The point here is that it's generally a bad idea to have summons that use AoE effects, because summons are as dumb as a box of hair. They will drop gazes over your party. They will use fear howl next to your front line. They will cheerfully see "point-blank range" as The Best Possible Use of Fireball.

The result is that a number of summons get the immediate response of "FUH FUH WHY YOU DO THAT [prioritise killing it over monsters] [threaten summoner]". Not because the summon is evil or ICly dangerous, but because the poor AI makes it a liability unless you utterly micromanage it. Giving the Eyeball a bunch of single-target effects is a lot better than a few AoEs. It could also probably do with losing onhit disease because it's rather wierd that an illusion causes that.

Also are we playing the same game, Crystalrose? Fire elementals are a joke, even Slimes have better AB than them. I agree with LiAlH4 that Illusion is remarkably cool and importantly, varied. Every level of summons has its niche as opposed to being the same monster with a little more AB.