Mages and ranged/touch attacks

[Drakill Tannan]

It seems spells that require a touch/ranged touch attack are rather easy to evade due to the laughable AB of sorcerers/wizards. Today i cast 4 in a row and none hit. I could have just been unlucky, however.

But in case i'm no the only one who feels this way, i thought it would be a good idea SF: Spell school gave +2 AB to all touch attacks of spells of that school that use it, and GSF: +4. Or if that's too much, maybe +1/+2 respectively.

PvP wise i suppose touch attacks are a hard counter to STR based characters with low DEX, but PvM i get the feeling they are almost useless.

[Coldburn]

I agree. The rate at which they hit is very poor.

[Coldburn]

Or as an alternative, perhaps their Intelligence, Wisdom or Charisma modifier added to the attack roll, whichever is highest.

[Drakill Tannan]

Not against that idea coldburn.

[lovethesuit]

Make a perk that allows a caster to add their main casting stat to Touch Attacks. OR, gives a straight +4 bonus to touch attacks.

[Howlando]

You have got to be kidding me.

[Johannes]

No. Just no. I am sorry. Those orb spells are balanced with touch attacks as they are. Already they are Nd6 elemental spells without reflex saves for half damage and status effects. They are powerful enough as is!

[Drakill Tannan]

I guess that's a no.
I suppose i can try the spell a bit more, see if it is more usefull than i thought.

[Johannes]

I will add, the spell deliberately does NOT take spell resistance or spell immunity into account!

[Egon the Monkey]

Unless they've been reverted, every arcane spell except Orbs that used to require a touch attack is now an auto-hit. So Ghoul Touch, Vampiric Touch, Burning Bolt, Scorching ray all hit. The Orbs have a touch attack because they ignore Spell Resistance. It's the tradeoff for being able to fry Drow and Nightrisers easily.

Touch Attacks don't count Armor, Shield or Natural AC, so you're looking at effectively +12 against an unbuffed fullplate/shield fighter or +5 against a Monk with Mage Armor up. Also, you can chug yourself a few potions to get that AB up. If you want to use Orbs, have some Dexterity on the PC or use Truestrike.

[Drakill Tannan]

Scorching ray does use a ranged touch attack. That's the spell i was refering to.

[Egon the Monkey]

Ah, that's definitely less useful. It didn't require one last time I used it, and made it great as one of the better ways to fight PCs with Evasion as a mage. The trouble is that PCs with high Reflex saves are the same ones with good AC vs touch attacks because  DEX counts for both. Scorching Ray did however get ridiculous on a L7+ mage empowering it for 8d6*1.5 dmg at long range. Haste, fire a pair, no chance to miss.  For low DEX chars, most evocations work nicely as they'll likely not make the save. Touch attack, no save spells are there to counter stuff with Evasion. Is Scorching Ray now not subject to SR/immunity?

Additionally, did any more spells get dropped back to touch attacks? I was thinking of using rays and touch spells on my next mage and didn't want to find out too late that I'd need STR or Dex for them.

[Drakill Tannan]

Scorching ray is not affected by SR, no. But it's not really a counter to things with evasion. Things with evasion often have high Dex, so the AB you need is higher to hit them. I imagine though, once i reach level 7 the rays will be better, i take it it's 1 roll for each, so it will be posible to strike "Partially". Still, i dobut a +4 AB will be nearly enough to hit most things out there.

[BrittanyPanthas]

Put points into dexterity and buff your dexterity if you want them to hit.

Ranged Touch AC for most people is 10+deflection+dodge.

That means the average Ranged touch AC for a PC on EfU that isn't a dexterity build... is about 11-12.  Buffed, it usually rises to about 14-15 if they use 'Shield'  NPCs are little better.

Not hard to hit at all.

Like any spell, you tailor your spell selection depending on the creature or the person, you don't use reflex spells or ranged touch AC spells against rogues or dexterity builds, for example.  You don't use fortitude spells against pure fighters/Barbarians.

[PlayaCharacter]

Bonus Feat: Spell Finesse.