Affordable Custom Armor for PC factions etc

[Egon the Monkey]

As most players know, it's possible to have some NPCs custom-design clothing and armor. Now, although this is done for cloth and leathers, the only time anyone does it for armor is when they want Full Plate and can't get it by any other means so they stump up the 4k. The problem is, other armor's just not affordable even as PC flavour gear or faction uniforms.

When I decided out of curiosity to see how much custom halfplate would cost (before my PC got Fullplate) it came out to 1800gp without any enhancements or unusual dyes. To put that into perspective, most quest loot halfplate sells for 3-400, shoploot stuff's around 900, and players sell Full Plate for the region of 2000-2300. Plus of course most drops have fairly sweet skill/save bonuses and the shoploot stuff comes with some handy skill boosts. It's even worse for medium armor, where it's not hard to get +1 ones for a few hundred.

My point here is that if it custom armor was cheaper along with its enhancements, players would buy it and use it. We'd see PCs with a distinctive look, PC-driven faction uniforms, and all sorts of cool stuff. It'd take money out of the PC economy and counter PCs getting hugely rich very fast by offering fancy prestige gear, like for expensive dyes. It would be less useful than quest drops for the same price, thus a vanity or uniform item still. My suggestion is to price the armor so that a basic set costs a bit more than PC prices or most shoploot (but unlike those, has no enhancements), and the enhancements are expensive but reasonable.

For example,

Halfplate:
Base cost for custom with a few dyes: 500
Cost to add something like a +1 save: 600
Cost of a questloot halfplate with +1 fort: Usually 300-350
That's expensive but not crippling. A rich merchant PC could easily cover 500 per guard to outfit his faction, for example.

Chainshirt:
Base cost for custom with a few dyes: 300
Cost to add +1 enhancement: 900
Cost of a +1 chainshirt: around 3-600 I've found

You could even keep the prices high but add a deep discount for Patricians, with the aim of promoting prominent Dominion PCs founding a House or organisation that is really visible. So Joe Powerquester might not want to pay 4k for Patricianship on top of 500-1000 for some 7AC armor, but for the leader of a PC faction that desires uniforms, it's kind of a big deal.

[gab1]

I highly agree, and and would go even further and suggest that they be made equal in price to loot equivelents for custom designed armors. In reality (as far as from what I can see from myself and other characters IC) most of these merchants that are NPCs would be bankrupt from the prices they sell things at, or at least on the teeter of bankruptcy. People rarely ever buy things from the NPC merchants, especially the heavy armors and other overpriced goods.

I know somewhat this is in place to keep the pc economy stimulated, so that all the gold doesnt go in NPC bank accounts, and i agree with that notion, but some level of leniency should be mediated.

So... i highly support this, for only decorative designs. 500 or 600 for half plate sounds good to me, even less, but this might make things too easy in the opinion of others.

[Divine Intervention]

Agree with this, anyone who quests hard enough can make four thousand pretty fast, whereas as a uniform device kittingbout a faction costs a load.  Pure fighters are rare enough, do lowering the price to acres their advantage of fullplate seems reasonable.

[gab1]

Then again, i totally did not think about dyes and metal stain. Erm... i'd actualy prefer people collecting stains and staining it themselves.

Im sure this could be much more easily aquired by simply searching, maybe DM assistance.

I like the variety and thematics of it all... (being more in line with the theme and the tone) than everyone having identical half plate, etc...

Didnt really think before posting the first time, though if anyone wants to volunteer to do this for the NPC crafters, mwa... i kiss your feet... probably shouldnt be that hard either way.

[Egon the Monkey]

D_I raises an interesting point on pure Fighters. A set of affordable and strong Pure Fighter Only OOCly restricted fullplate off an NPC could give them a little boost over fighter/X multiclasses in the same way that there's powerful stealth armors out there for pure druids and pure rangers only. It would also not boost Clerics like cheaper FP would.

[Letsplayforfun]

You're living in a ruined town, that struggles to survive, that can't feed people, can't pay it's troops, and you think people are worried about adventurers dying (oups) their full plate armor?

It's a luxury you're wanting. If you get the money, dye your armor. If you're too poor to do so, tough luck. This is no beauty contest. And gold comes sooo easy if you really have a group...

For what it's worth, i've done custom armors for preludes groups, which i'm fine doing again. But portal rats are just that: rats. ;)

[Ebok]

For what it is worth. I'm a fan of the oversized cost of the custom gear. To have armor made for you is expensive, to customize it means the crafter is making only a few of it's kind. Uniforms can be done with color schemes easily enough if you are going that route. On top of the economic stresses, finding and reusing your enemies  scarred up armor makes more sense to be widely practiced. If custom armors compete with PC merchants selling loot drops then it's the merchants that lose out. Then you have the unique factor again, most of the players don't have unique armor, which makes the unique and impressive stuff all the more impressive.

So I'm a fan of the current costs. (yes I have paid for them on multiple occasions)

[MrGrendel]

Mundane customized armor with a bit of dye should not cost twice as much as good, magical armor on the market.

All this is doing is making a neat but underpowered option be nearly unused. It should be the other way around.

All the way back to tribal paint and tabards, people have set their groups apart by similar markings. This is in my opinion not a matter of luxury but a nice feature which is going unused because it's skewed way out of the normal economy.

[BRESTON]

Gold rains from the sky, 4000 is cheap and you can add +1 will to it for 1500gp if that function isn't still broken. ( I have reported it once or twice )

Maybe if you patricians went out with your banners and did all the no DM required activities set in place like, protecting the farmland, lumbermill, mine whatever. You may get some merchants inclined to help you out down the road. Since you have made their merchandise less expensive to produce.

Save the world, get benefits.

[Iron Oligarch]

There's a vendor who sells dye in the marketplace. You can dye an armor anything you want for around 150 gold, with the exception of plot items. Instead of buying customized armor, and then dying it, why not just use dyes on what you have?

[Talir]

I don't mind helping prominent, visual and proactive PC groups with uniforms if said group was moving towards it and want it. If you believe this is you or could be you, just have a talk with me. We are not going to base the shop loot / customized armour on what the PC merchants set for their trades.

The reason why dying armour into specific colours instead of making customized armour is, precisely put, due to the expenses incurred and that you'll often find better throughout the quests; and since some are more worried about stats than looks they take the scavenged goods. When buying customed equipment, you trade stats for looks and is another way to show off your PC.

[Underbard]

Gold rains from the sky?  I've yet to have a PC earn enough gold to make a difference. My first fighter on EFUA only got fullplate because someone died.  My second fighter  had plate handed to him at level 3, again, because someone died. In comparison, in EFU, gold was everywhere.  While I don't think custom loot for PC factions should just be handed out, I would hardly say that a group of say 6 PC's could find themselves looking like the marines inside a week.

[BRESTON]

Well, the selection is fairly limited. Though Old Port has quite a variety of tasteful dyes.

Gold is very accessible, you just need to look in the right places. Which I wont divulge under any circumstances.

[Mailbox Arson]

If you have a cool/successful PC faction you'll have no problem buying dyes so you can all have matching uniforms.

If you want to look truly unique, drop those $$$ on the custom armor. I see no reason to make custom armor cheap.

[MrGrendel]

Why all the nay-saying here?

It's a feature the DMs put in to be used, and it's not seeing its full potential. I've yet to encounter a recognizable PC group uniform since like the Underdark.

This is not about "individuals should have to pay lots extra to look cooler than me in my snazzy gear." It's about making player factions cooler.

On a related note, I remember when full plate was rare, and prices asked now are far less. The market has likely changed since the prices were last set. They need to be lowered even if for no other reason than that they are outdated.