Awesome loot? Where?

[Nightshadow]

Warning, this is a bit of a rant... It's just something that has been bugging me during what has been nearly three years of playing EfU.

I log in, and drag my impoverished self around the server, doing quests, roleplaying, and getting into all sorts of conflict. I rarely have a character these days that isn't out pursuing his goals to the best of his ability and doing my best to involve people in this conflict, be they with me or against me, or moving along plots and factions to the best of my ability.

Almost invariably, I fail. I love EfU, I enjoy the conflict, but constant defeat is leaving a sour taste in my mouth. Occasionally I manage to succeed in something but overall if I get into PvP, I'm on the ground, and fast. Fighting against my characters is almost an assured victory.

Why is this? Because unlike everyone else on this server, I do not have an infinite supply of potions. I grab everything I can, use as little as possible to succeed, and collect and sell all sorts of simple items to merchants. With potion brewers I haggle for better deals to ensure I get as many potions as possible for as little coin as possible.

I'm doing my best, but I can't get anywhere on any of my characters, none of the goals on any of my characters in three years, be they app or not, has succeeded, despite my best efforts.

Many of you will say and have said in the past that the end result isn't what matters, it's the fun you have along the way. Yes. The intrigue, the action, the adventure, it's all fun. What's not fun is losing, all the time (a few exceptions here and there, and recently there was a rather significant victory against a certain powerful PC, but this is still just getting to be too much).

This post is also not about any single incident. I don't hate anyone here, I'm just tired of this. I'm tired of being poor, I'm tired of having crappy supplies, I'm tired of dying over and over and over again. I'm tired of being a noob after playing here for 3 years. I feel rich when I have 600 gold and a good supply of minor and light healing, with a few more powerful healing trinkets and scattered potions, but I'm seeing everyone else running around in awesome custom full plate, with scores of potions and thousands of gold.

What am I doing wrong? Am I not involving enough people? Am I not pursuing my goals hard enough? Am I doing too much? Please help me, I don't want to have to leave EfU.

[Egon the Monkey]

If you want shedload of supplies, you really need to be on a strong team that's capable of hitting quests with minimal supply loss, or to run a merchant or brewing side business that brings in the money. If there's no quest team near you, round one up. Also, everyone else doesn't have unlimited supplies and custom plate. For evidence, just look at all the PCs in halfplate.

If you want to achieve goals, you need to set ones you've got a good chance of. It doesn't help that you havent posted any of them for your past PCs so we can see what you were trying to do. Some players will tell you to aim high and hope you get at least half way, but that seems like you'd still write it off as a loss. I'd say, find goals where you don't need to "Win". Find a server mystery people have left hanging and work on it. Build something up in a way that doesn't require DMs. That's how Fellhammer Hold started, with 4-5 dwarves beating up whatever sat in that cave once per reset and talking about drams ofr a clanhold. Post your goals in an OOC journal thread. That way interested DMs can see even if they're not on for your RP

As for PVP, pick your battles. Cross was a ranged rogue who picked a duel with a fighter/cleric. That was only going to go one way unless you'd spammed him with slow traps or something. Don't be afraid to leg it away from a better supplied opponent or use invis or Darkness to buy time. If you use Invis and Retreat to run off, and they chugged Haste/displace/trustrike, congratulations, you won that round. A lot of EfU PCs appear to suffer from this Mist-Induced stubbornness to always fight to the death. Back down, refuse challenges. Then send a hired goon after the problem if you want him wiped out. Rat your enemy out for something to a faction who'd be happy to kill him. RwG's played a lot of characters who'd get their ass handed them in a straight showdown, but manipulated things so there was very little opportunity to do that (believe me on this, I stalked Bartemis for weeks :P).

If you want people involved with you, offer a reason. I_O kept the Laddermen going by a simple trick: Paid his goons well, sold them cheap potions. Now, not every PC has deep pockets like that, but the plots that tend to get rolling are those that reward their participants. Not, "Join me, it'll be fun" but "join me, we'll pay you if you do well" or "Join me, we'll get power this way"

My big tip: Don't try and lead anything on this or maybe your next PC. Pick a player who's got a big plot or faction going, and play them a kick-ass lieutenant. Hitch yourself to that bandwagon and see how they do it. Playing someone's henchman, you get ideas passed to you and you know they have support from another PC. You can work on your own goals too, but you also have ones where you know other players/PCs are interested and you'll be rewarded for completing them.

[Canzah]

I'm not in the mood for making a long post here, but I'll try to hit you up later for a chat NightShadow. I'd really hate to see you leave!

[Spiffy Has]

Becoming a goon to an established PC is a good way to achieve what amounts to good loot and supplies.

[Paha]

I am not sure what I could say to be sure recipe for gaining things.

What I know, is that you need time and unfortunately usually quite bit activity and effort. Then you do well to have allies and people around you, doing things that differ from questing and such. In my own example currently, it has been underdark expedition, certain other extremely hard, long, sometimes productive journeys and there has always been a risk where success means just those rewards, and failure could very well mean the end of the concept.

The usual deal is, that time,effort and risk often equals appropriate rewards.

[Nuclear Catastrophe]

You're worrying too much, Nightshadow.  There's no point getting stressed.  You're not doing anything wrong.  In fact you're doing everything RIGHT.  You've had a lot of strong PC's over the years and Orlando is another one.

I would have given Orlando some custom loot last week but Howland said he had beaten me to it, so didn't. (Not that I want to rope poor H into this, he has a hard enough time as it is!)

So... I don't know.  

You might just be unlucky.  You might not be in the right circles as far as allies go.  You might actually just be thinking the grass is greener on the other side of the hill, when the reality is anything but.

[tropic]

NS, I love all of your PCs.

My advice is to ask RwG for advice.

Edit: Oh, and... be a little greedy when loot hits the floor. Grab a CSW or two. When PvP is about to go down, chug every potion you have and then make the best of it.

Edit2: Also, I saw you light up (literally) a looted-out, months-old PC earlier this week in about three rounds. Are your losses in PvP really so bad? Most PvP ends up being ganking, anyway...

[petey512]

Yeah sometimes you just have to be a bit of a jerk when the loot hits the floor. :/

[Howlando]

My experience observing your play-style, admittedly from a distance, is that you have a tendency to fearlessly antagonize powerful characters while in a position of weakness. Although I think that can be very good (in the sense of extreme IC courage), if you're growing tired of losing PvP you might consider incorporating some wisdom and/or cowardice into your next concept.

"Supply acquistion" is another matter, and one that I'm not sure I want to discuss publicly.

[TheDarkMoon]

Night Shadow, Myself and a friend of mine are running a concept right now, We are both well developed and if you care wouldnt mind to bring another under thier wing, If you are tired of not being "The most supplied or powerfull" Well, You can join our cell and we will attempt to give you that. The thing is, When you want to be powerfull or the like, -Its Hard- It takes dear gods amounts of luck and skill to survive certain quests and do things for not just the loot but for the sheer potion value. It turns into an unfun number crunching game.
 
If you want send me a PM I can work with you and we can resolve this issue.

[Howlando]

From my observations, this -

Yeah sometimes you just have to be a bit of a jerk when the loot hits the floor. :/

is not true. Rather, it's more....

The characters that get rich from questing almost invariably are part of a group that cooperates and works together well as a team. Typically the loot is collected by one character that acts as support for the group. Some supplies will be handed out throughout the course of the quest as needed/used by characters. The best stuff (choicest potions, etc.) will be given out to the primary tank-type. All the little stuff that will be sold to a NPC merchant is kept by the leader/support-PC and either handed out later or given out to allies when characters need to purchase supplies.

I think this kind of co-operative dynamic is great, and even better than the more common alternative of random quest groups where everyone is mostly out for themselves, however I would say that I think it's very important it remains inclusive both on an IC and OOC level. In the past there's a troubling tendency for some veteran players to mostly play amongst each other, for example, that I don't think is in the best interests of the server.

But when characters come together IC'ly as part of an interesting concept, cooperate with their questing, and do well it can often turn into something very nice and all the characters involved can get the supplies they need much more easily than you would just from hanging around the Ziggurat and waiting for the next random quest to head out.

[Craig210]

You once told me you start concepting your next character once you are bored with your current character. Cross had allot of potential, but before he could really shine you already had a new idea in mind and then you suicided against a much tougher opponent.

The new character concept you had in mind didn't last long either and now your playing crowlee. The people you look at who reach these high levels, amass potions and receive loot do not get it over night, or even in a week.

Yes your characters are conflict heavy, they are intense and well played. But much like RwG you play short and brief constantly moving onto the next idea that while may be better than the last is equally as short lived. However unlike RwG, you expect the best of both worlds. From what I have seen RwG understands that while short lived, conflict heavy, flash in the pan characters are fun to play and suit his style of play. He also knows that some(not all) DM's are less likely to invest time and energy into something that will be done and dusted in a week, whether suicided in pvp or simply faded out on a quest death.


My suggestion would be to store the concepts you have in mind, write them down and keep them for later. Play a character to a proper end.Whether it be assassination( a duel to the death if truly appropriate) execution or a matyr on a dm event saving everyone else. Do these things because it was the right thing to do, or you had no choice in the matter. Don't throw away a character because things seemed dull, stick with it and if you had ideas speak to the DM team and see what can be organised.


I personally play to have fun, loot, potions gp mean nothing to me. I left a server that became too concerned over these things over RP.

[Coldburn]

Most of us live from quest to quest as well. You drink a couple of potions, and hope your quest reward offers you slightly more in return. Some days you win some, some days you lose some, but over time it begins to build up.

That said, what Howland says is extremely true. A group of players questing as a team as opposed to individuals, which translates into proper loot sharing as well, is so much more effective.

I am not a fan of everyone gathering loot during the quest and then dropping it all on the ground after the end, where people just rush from item to item to snatch things up. I have had excellent experience with player who are the sole collectors, and they decide who gets what in the party - admittedly, this takes both IC and OOC trust. FishyBusiness handles this technique extremely well on his Sorcerer, staying invisibile, collecting, and bartering us our share even during the quest so we never run out of any supplies. And you know (or at best hope but are fooled) that everyone gets what they deserve.

I would encourage a mentality change in this.

[TheImpossibleDream]

Howland covered everything with regard to how to make sure you're supplied. To summerize for those foolish enough not to read his words in full: Make friends, stick together, and look out for each other, include others and try to make them do the same for you. This applies to all alignments.

As for "losing all the time"

Everybody loses. There is no winning. Ever.

You do not win.

There is no screen with a  big picture of Naga waving a golden trophy with his arm around an angry howland captioned with "A winner is you" in efu.

All the best characters intended to do so much more before they eventually lost. Some people can delay losing for a while or veil it by retiring thier characters via various means (boating away from the isle etc.)

Enjoy the journey there is no end.

To coldburn that method is as old as time itself. It just does not take easily to people new to it <_<

[Divine Intervention]

Been mentioned before, but unless you are playing a really ballsy character or a paladin, don't be afraid to run and fight another day.  If someone beats you down and threatens your life if you don't swear never to retaliate, lie.  When you are in a position of weakness you don't need to spit in your enemy's eye.  As for supplies and pvp, i strongly suggest that you get dispels, people can hoard potions but they can be easily removed with a well placed dispel.  I've enjoyed all my experiences with your characters and you definately shouldn't quit.