Factions

[I can has fun?]

"EFU will be boring for you, then. Think of it like your university. EFU factions are like the clubs and organizations of your university. In order to be a member of a community and make an impact on your school, you must be a member of one of these."

This is a really great analogy.

[Dilandau Kale]

Well to add my two cents to the pot in regards to factions. First I would like to say I'm not trying to put anyone down or criticise anyone I'm just saying what I have observed. The thing with these factions is if there is not a big NPC Part advertising them then my character makes judgement based on what the Pc's of that group do. Unfortunately from my interactions with a lot of the Pc's as far as Nikki is Ic concerned there all pretty much the same. Ooc I know the factions are different but I'm just not getting that feeling in game.

[Xorisai]

But like a University, if the clubs and organizations don't appeal to you, you make your own.  For whatever reason, people aren't as interested in the existing (DM) ones.  The possible reasons for this have already been discussed.  This may well change, but for now I think it's interesting to see what survives and what fails among all the new group initiatives started by players.

Edit: I'd be more interested in seeing DMs support and "adopt" PC-started factions that gain followers and look promising.  Such factions are more likely to be integral to the culture and function of the Ziggurat, since they got their start there, and aren't just overseas extensions of foreign groups and networks.

[Oroborous]

One issue, maybe worth raising elsewhere is that NPCs are necessary for DMs to tell stories. DM factions should have NPCs, cool PC factions should *GAIN* NPC supporters.

Fawkes in charge of a watch composed of only PCs would have been ridiculous. I've tried to run player factions, they typically fall apart because of a lack of DM attention or support which propels the faction toward a goal.

I think the model EfU:A could aim for is DM factions such as the Toboerski and PC factions such as the Toboerski.

Essentially, the faction had as a bonus:

1) Goals that were very direct. Destroy Chosen, take over Lower Sanctuary.

2) NPC aid. An elder Toboerski and his henchmen who supplied support to the faction when it was seriously requested

3) PC control. NPCs did stuff in the background but left all the daily stuff to a PC who was more or less in charge as long as he kept to the faction's goal.

4) Loot. Not free loot, but loot that could be purchased. This meant that there was not need for application to the faction (powerful gear wasn't free, you purchased it).

DM and PC factions should both aim for that. A good and solid mixture of perks, prestige, power--but without anything that unbalances things too much.

PCs should run the militia in game, but they should also have NPCs in the militia to provide support. They should have some NPCs to offer their support--honestly--the only offer I saw so far came from the Stygians rather than a *single* NPC in the city. It was so player driven, that interest and activity has been extremely low in what is typically a very attractive faction for people to join.

Finally, if people aren't joining DM factions--look at what PC factions they're joining and provide DM support to those. Assuming, that faction is trying to make the awesome happen.

[Sandstorm]

I think Oroborous is hitting on some fundamental points in his last two posts.

[derfo]

lol wow you guys make some inane points

I am sincerely confused as to how people find the simplicity of getting an application accepted. Even I once wrote a couple paragraphs of nonsense, bothered a bunch of DMs on occasion, and they let me be an idiot giant, because I had a goal. I'm sure everyone playing here except DangerousDan possesses enough creativity to create an original/interesting goal with some effort, then write a couple paragraphs about it. It's not difficult to write an elementary essay on something you should be enjoying, aka your character and his/her goals, and in return recieving the means to more easily achieve such goals, and buddies backing you up in said goals. It is like playing a game where you have only DangerousDan on your team and a dumpster as a weapon, then once you make a successful app, you get like Krunto and a dinosaur on your team and a rocket launcher instead.

As far as being unable to find players involved in the faction to interact with you is involved, I see how it can be helpful, but definitely not a necessity. I'm sure that at one point none of these factions had any player characters, and have an opportunity to grow, and as a member you probably will have a significant piece as to molding it's future and all that. If anything, it just seems that the faction could use more presence in your time zone, and it'd probably be easier to get approved. Even then, I created a fat black guy in Noble's Tunic running away from a cobra and managed to find like three PC faction members of different factions without trying.

As far as all the complaints about inner-faction history/interactions being a bore or non-existent seem incredibly unfounded, considering most (if not all) who complained did not even attempt to find anything out yet. You'd think with the posts of old EFU factions, or what was revealed upon the ending of EFU, that the same DMs who made the present factions probably realized what was good and bad then, and attempted to make the current ones better. Basically, from what I've seen, people are saying "I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE FACTION, SO IT MUST BE BLAND EVEN THOUGH I DIDN'T REALLY PUT ANY EFFORT INTO FIGURING ANYTHING OUT."

i could rant on in grammar but i think that's enough and i'm probably just repeating other posts i didn't read

tldr; apps are easy, better to be in groups, don't judge book by cover etc.

[Metro_Pack]

Factions suck

ANARCHY~

[lovethesuit]

Actually yeah, I'm beginning to see where the concerns are coming from. This whole NPC parade on top of the Ziggurat is just a little ridiculous.

[The Beggar]

I haven't applied because none of the current factions, or the current PCs in them, have really captured my interest. For me to want to have fun with a character in a faction, I need to enjoy the idea surrounding the faction, and for some reason I just haven't gotten there yet.

I do not think this is in any way a lack of effort on the part of the DMs involved in said factions, or on the players that are currently in them, it's just that I personally don't have an interest in the agendas that I perceive the factions as pushing forward. When I get to that point I will jump right in. For some reason I'm just not being "grabbed" so to speak.

Edited to add:

BTW, I also do think Oro made some very valid points. From the player angle that I have had in game the factions just don't have that "bite" that intruiges me to find out more. I don't think this at all is a knock on the DM time and effort. No one can honestly knock that in any way right now.

[Sternhund]

For the record, I agree that DMs should adopt some of the most successful player factions with NPC + Loot support. I've done so in the past with EFU, and if I ever get time, I hope to do so again in EFUA. And it is my hope that other DMs pick up on this. I know some others have, but it's always great to see more of it.

[Pup]

Just to throw this out there:

I personally have enjoyed my faction chars far more than my non-faction ones, whether they were a leader or a follower.  I've only been playing on the new server for a few days, with a char I made to test the waters a bit.  In those few days I have already decided on a faction and a concept to pursue based solely on what I've seen IG and on the forums.  In fact, I will be rolling him up later tonight.

My point is that I saw plenty of faction "evidence", and based on that I can't wait to dive in.  I really don't see a problem.  Of course, I'm just a Pup.

[Xorisai]

Basically, from what I've seen, people are saying "I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE FACTION, SO IT MUST BE BLAND EVEN THOUGH I DIDN'T REALLY PUT ANY EFFORT INTO FIGURING ANYTHING OUT."

This doesn't really work if you are approaching a faction from an IC perspective.  Some people may think "I want to try this faction out" and make a character in order to get in that faction, and for them your advice makes sense - don't judge a book by its cover.

But if your approach is to start with a character and join a faction based on the character's IC perception of the factions, your advice isn't helpful.  If the factions are super-mysterious and have awesome backstories and all that but don't communicate at least some of that in game to prospective new members, it's hard for me to come up with an IC reason as to why my character would be interested.

I 'm not saying either way is wrong or right or whatever, it's just that if the current DM factions are having trouble getting traction with players, it may be because of a lack of interest OOC (i.e. what TheBeggar just posted) or a lack of information IC, depending on how people approach joining a faction.

[Wern8]

I believe the DM factions are quite fine as they are and that there is much more to them than most of the players think, but as for myself, I find none of them, except maybe the Forgotten Flower to be fitting for the kind of character I would play and create, so I will likely stick to PC factions, try the current ones out there or attempt to form my own.

[derfo]

But if your approach is to start with a character and join a faction based on the character's IC perception of the factions, your advice isn't helpful.  If the factions are super-mysterious and have awesome backstories and all that but don't communicate at least some of that in game to prospective new members, it's hard for me to come up with an IC reason as to why my character would be interested.

Upon making a random character, I entered the Kingsman, then there was a Fleet of the First Bolt whatever who told me the basics of the faction and such. That seems like enough IC to me, and I'm assuming the other factions have something similar, granted I have not explored enough to locate this. I thought it sort of went without saying that if a big faction with whoever leader with whatever code got there in some fashion, at the least most reasonably intelligent characters would be able to interpet that and would have at least some sort of interest. I don't think any faction is going to IC recruit going "we have some cool dicknasty secrets to learn, come join." I mean, if they have big flashy doom uniforms and such then that should be enough to think "hm they must've got these somehow therefore that is at least some sort of history probably"

[Ommadawn]

derflaro, it's not always so simple. As far as I know, the faction I was interested in has no NPC contacts, and I was told by the DM to find out about it and pursue it IG. That's been difficult to impossible, but I haven't given up yet.

As for the other factions, I am certain they are interesting, deep and fun to play in, but I haven't developed a "bug" to chase them as I did the Forgotten Flower.

Really, it's still early days for the new setting, and I'm sure as DM factions become more established, they will continue to draw more interested players.

And Lado, please don't take offense at posts that try to answer your questions in the OP. I'm sure none was intended!