PvPing attitude

[SkillFocuspwn]

I apologise if this looks like I'm simply a rant about the current affairs of the server or any such, but with the tensions between the current factions, I think this is a question worth asking.

Say you, as a Stygian and a mortal enemy of the Sons, are informed there is one standing in the Inner Ruins buying something off a trader there. You've heard of this Son before, but never had the opportunity to meet him IG.

In this situation, I accept full well that it is fine to go there with some of your buddies, beat him down if you're feeling violent, harass him. However, would you consider it acceptable to FD this individual, due to the animosity between Factions?

I have always thought that the only interaction that mattered as a precursor for PvP was actual and personal (with the obvious exception of hunting monster creatures). I know of at least one occasion when it's happened in the UD as well though, where a player who has never met another player has FDed them solely due to the fact they were of opposing factions.

In some cases I can understand this. If Banite Joe is currently leading a small army of Undead to destroy the city, it is acceptable for Paladin George to smite his face up, regardless of PC interaction beforehand. However, would it be acceptable for a Paladin to kill the Priest if he were simply preaching?

So, where does the line stand between these two? Is a Stygian valid FDing stock for a Stargazer, regardless of interaction before? Do you believe there should be at least a meeting before two faction-opposing PCs go at each-others throats, or do you believe the tension between them should be 100% personal, formed by their actions and their interactions with the other?

This isn't a rhetoric rant, I am actually curious about the personal opinions and feelings of the players on this matter. When and how to PvP is one of the massive complications of EfU without any rules beyond the obvious but a whole heap of social lines in what is cool PvP and what is distasteful. So, what are your opinions on this?

[TheImpossibleDream]

Depends on the situation really. For example the Stygian's were warned against roaming the wilds by a particular stargazer under pain of death. This stargazer finds a group of adventurers lead by a Stygian our in the wilds. In this situation.

Even if they've never met. A warning has been disregarded and failure to act appropriately would be out of character and send a message to other characters that you don't intend to act upon your warning.

I'm sure there are many similiar examples that could be made.

[Gippy]

It is perfectly reasonable if they've earned the death through IC actions. It is generally harder to earn death if you've never met someone, but it is certainly possible.

[Garem]

Your example of Banite Joe and Paladin George is good, but of course when you look at specific situations that are not so clear cut (and they almost never are) then you just have to make a judgement call based on what factors you know.

If one of the aforementioned adversaries defeats the other, and as he lay bleeding the defeated spews forth a string of curses and threats of divine vengeance-- definitely a good time for a momentous FD death! If they're begging for their life, then use it as an RP opportunity. Something like this has circumstantially happened to me recently, and now my PC has been severely altered psychologically because of it-- he doesn't go anywhere near his conqueror's "realm" without a damned good reason to do so. Now, should we clash again, I'm certainly not inclined to FD him despite a plethora of good reasons to do so because I've already got some more creative outcomes in mind. Eventually, we'll either come to the point where one must win, one must lose, or the PCs' stories will take them to a different direction and conclusion.

I think that's the ideal we strive for. Until you get to the black and white or within respectable reaching distance, it's always best to use the situation to fuel the story along. That being said, absolutely use it to your advantage, force them to change the way their story is "planned"! Make the Banite fear something more than Bane, or force the holy paladin to do a deed so vile his redemption will be nearly impossible.

Creativity is a plus, but if you want to be simple, just take some of their swag and leave them with a warning. Resist the urge to turn this server into a glorified Arena server, because that ain't what it's about. That's my feeling about it. And when in doubt, a little OOC communication rarely hurts.

[Mannykins]

For quite a while there has been a "Kill on sight" mentality between the Sons and the Armada. That for me does not mean I go into Full Damage mode every time I encounter a member of the Sons. When a member of the Sons attempted to kill someone on the Ziggurat he was not immediately executed but instead there was some intense RP and he was sent back to the docks with even more reasons to hate the Stygians.

Factions have enemies but I don't think that means killing someone who you've never met before just because they are from your enemy faction.

Make an enemy, send the rest of the faction a warning but I don't think you should just kill someone for wearing the wrong colours, this isn't the west coast, yet!

[TheImpossibleDream]

You wouldn't run around the docks wearing your Stygian uniform and expect to live I would hope!

Mind you in the instance that I believe brought this post about, we could have easily made sure it was completely impossible for you to ever come back to life instead of leaving you with someone likely to raise you.

[Mannykins]

If history is to be trusted, I'd expect to return to the colony slightly pink.

[Ebok]

Random FD without just cause or interaction is always bad IMO. I don't like doing it even when it's a monster, I want to at least use the death as an opportunity for some serious interaction. Stygians drylooting or killing sons wimpy for being in the market is meh is me. Stygians in the docks seems like it's asking to get mauled though that might be due to my bias in the question. I've had my ass handed to me in pvp, and I've seen it done badlyand epically in both situations. So, it typically, I prefer creative ways to fuck with the other party.

[Thomas_Not_very_wise]

If history is to be trusted, I'd expect to return to the colony slightly pink.

win

[derfo]

Avoiding FD is cool, but circumstances should be considered

[ForsakenSunlight]

I agree that FD amongst strangers is odd.
 
There are always situations. Look at Igors recent castle invasion (That never happened.) Had people shown up on either side, it was known death might occur.
 
 
There are always situations, where groups of so and so, attack group of so and so.
 
I just think individual fding, without interaction is bad taste..

[TheMacPanther]

Personally I go subdual first and let things unfold from there, you never know if you would be able to use the fight for better more creative IG reasons. Also as someone who has been on the bad side of FD ganks, as monsters and as PCs,a few left me with a real sore spot for a while because of how much I enjoyed the chars.
A FD kill without giving the other player time to interact at all is real bad taste in my book.
However I would say that if it were a large scale battle (eg. Ivor's army vs. Blackhearth) then you shouldn't really be bound by subdual because of the nature of the fight.

[scrappayeti]

For me a FD decision is  a combination of IC and OOC factors, which is what makes it hard to balance.

For example if your character's best friend was murdered, I would think it was okay to retaliate in kind, even if you had not roleplayed extensively together. Like the Paladin and the Necromancer, I don't want the avoidance of FD to break the suspension of disbelief.  

But its also good to balance OOC factors, like degree of RP together, coolness of the death, special app status of the defeated character and so on.

In short, I think the best PvP question is "can I reasonably get away with not killing that character, or is it going to look really contrived?".

[derfo]

this is a game btw just throwing that out there

[9lives]

Sick, irony