Trolls

[scrappayeti]

While I have done this quest with some hard nuts without problem, the other day we had a moderate party, nothing that would seem to indicate a massive spawn, and the first wave of trolls over ran the party.

Not that this shouldn't ever happen, but it did seem like there were an awful lot trolls compared to previous runs. I cannot say I hope to understand the mechanics of the static, but either there are some unusual random factors, or the quest does not scale very well with size. The type of secondary range mob that spawns next to the melee and pus trolls also makes a big difference, although if this is random or average level triggered I dont know.

I am wary of a quest that is only doable if OOC knowledge is used to make it manageable, such as small party only for this one; or the spamming of ranged attacks on small lights a good distance away to prevent dispels and lure mobs.

Just as an aside, why the hell with all the machismo? Why can someone not say they think a quest is too hard without getting flamed? Did we join the army while I wasnt looking?

[Equinox]

This quest is fine, it encourages you to take a decent shooter, with one of them its actually pretty easy.

[FleetingHeart]

Simple solution.

Tell -any- single full AB class to bring a ranged weapon and shoot things! You don't need any feats to be a decent archer!

[RIPnogarD]

Better solution...

Have a preset range weapon drop somewhere at the very begging of the quest. Not saying magic bows or anything, just a few normal bows and ammo. If the players don't get the hint to bad so sad.

If DM's make a quest where something is needed to complete the quest (or will make it that much easier) then they should make that 'whatever' available somewhere in the beginning. If the players use it they use it, if they dont they dont, if they think about it latter in the scenario they can run back and grab that certain something. But to say use your OOC knowlegge and bring "X" with you before you start the quest is silly.

[Caddies]

Your group is a seasoned troupe of adventurers. Hardly silly that some of them take a bow and arrow or a crossbow and some bolts along. :p

[BoomdaddyBP]

And while long range makes it simpler, I have done this quest where one or two of the frontliners saw the lights cast there annoying stuff on first encounter and the rest of the quest they ran straight to that light, (yes, attracting huge mobs) killed it, and did fine throughout the quest.

[UnholyWon]

It isn't the DMs 'job' to supply the player. Its the players job to use their brain to make sure there character is well supplied. The only PC that likely doesn't run around with a bow or any projectial weapon is the Stygians, because long range weapons are for wimps.

If your playing an axe wielding maniac or sword and shield hero then perhaps your party should have the usual suspects, one them being a scout with a bow or some PC with a ranged weapon. I don't know, boost your PC's INT and WIS score and make that informed decision easier.

I do have to go back to the DM's 'JOB' of suppling the character. The DM's job to supply character can be seen just about everywhere through the server including the first place most new PCs visit, the visitor's tower and there in the donations chest that appears every reset is A) A sling B) Bullets. I'm not a genius, but OMG!

1) It appears before the adventure;
2) The DMs supply it regularly;
3) Its not OOC knowledge to be prepared;
4) Its your own damn fault if you don't have a ranged weapon because your DEX is to low.

The server is supposed to be challenging, not a table top PnP hold your hand monty hall adventure.

[ScruffyMcSmirkalot]

Commenting on this briefly... since... ugh... I didn't want to wake up right now, but now I can't go to sleep...
 
I did a run not long ago... first one in a long time... we had about a group of 7, with a lot of support casters. We rolled through it fairly well, and yes, the dispel was near-fatal for frontliners at time (only with massive amount of support casting was it successful).
 
The thing I noticed though.... was... (and I don't -think- this is too much of a spoiler) With our group of 7... none of the trolls that toss rocks spawned. Not a single one. Were these removed from the quest in an earlier update? or is this some sort of spawn abnormality?
 
Since I did it back when Naida was alive.... and whooooo... sheesh the killer rock-throw spam.
 
Well? :p

[RIPnogarD]

It isn't the DMs 'job' to supply the player.

We'd all have naked PC's if this were true.


If there is something that is needed, (or will make something that much easier), it is the DM's job to make sure it is available to the players. Just because 90% of the "seasoned troupes" will have access to bull strength means that 10% wont. If a bull strength is needed to complete a quest then it's the DM's job to ensure one is to be had someplace in the scenario. <(That's just an example! Dont go saying a bull strength isn't needed for the troll quest!)

I may not know how to work the computer side of DMing this game, but I know what it is to be a "DM".

[UnholyWon]

Its called 'MERCHANTS' you buy supplies from them! The DMs supply the game with 'MERCHANTS'

[Gnome on the Strange]

This quest was fine as it was.the dispellers were glass cannons that a bow, darts or cantrip wand will crush. Easily countered but  deadly if you don't make that effort. The other mobs are persistently dangerous but low crit power, meaning there are few WTF axecrit wipes. Now though, there are tough dispel spamming invised mages that you can't reasonably trash before you get dispelled.  Since decent dispels can easily debuff even a L8 or 9 caster IMO they need to be balanced by being on weak mobs if they are common on a quest.

[UnholyWon]

We'd all have naked PC's if this were true.

Its called 'MERCHANTS' you buy supplies from them! The DMs supply the game with 'MERCHANTS'

DMs provide opportunities for players. Its up to the player to take the opportunity and make the best of it.

Now if Joe Meatbag doesn't buy a melee weapon or a ranged weapon, healing supplies, potions, armor, rations, or various other ingredients from the provided DM vendor, then OMG we'd all naked.

But you know what, the DM provided the player with a merchant to buy neato things to survive the server. The DMs even provided players with trash piles to dig through for crap other players didn't want. Not to mention the donation chest, again, in the visitors tower.

From my point of view, the DMs have given the players more then enough vendors to use their adventuring gold to purchase the items needed to complete the majority of the server's quests.

<(That's just an example! Dont go saying a bull strength isn't needed for the troll quest!)

Bull Strength isn't needed, its nice to have though. Especially if I take the time to seek out a NPC vendor the DM has provided or even a player vendor to purchase a bull strength potion.

[putrid_plum]

This quest can be hard but it is fun as hell.  Not every quest needs to be or should be carebear cakewalk.  If anything ORCS should be made harder, since it is OMG sadly easy.  I once more... agree with Caddies, BRING a bowman they are out there!

[Gippy]

This quest, like orcs, scales very poorly past 4-5 people. I think it is a reasonable thing to look into. For now -- you've been warned.

[NoneButTheBrave]

I believe I was in the same group as the OP on this one. We stomped through the quest, the problem is not the difficulty per se, but rather the ridiculous amount of potions and supplies you burn through while attempting it. I don't think he was asking for trolls to be made weaker, but rather for the dispel spam to be somewhat LESS.

You drink a potion, get dispelled, waste more supplies, get dispelled. There are a LOT of those buggers around too. It is my understanding that quests are meant to be fun. This is not fun at all. I am all for a challenge, I welcome one and expect one whenever I do a quest. That isn't the issue here.

After you have burnt through many EXPENSIVE potions the rewards, in my opinion, are lackluster.

I felt that the final boss fight was a great challenge, and an interesting battle. Everything leading up to that was a chore. I'm not saying it shouldn't be tough, but if you think of the price for each potion used NOT INCLUDING HEALING you do not earn this much coin at the end.