Make Watchers app-only

[MaimedGod]

The Watchers are supposed to be a trained and relatively competent force. The fact that virtually any concept, from chaotic evil Orcus worshipers to lawful good paladins of Torm, can sign on and get into the Watchers with relative ease stands in almost immediate opposition to that fact. Watchers, in general, have a long and storied history on EFU:R of disappearing, flaking out, et cetera. The amount of power that an individual Watcher has is not insignificant, and I honestly think that requiring apps even for individual, rank-and-file Watchers would be a very good thing to increase the IC presence and prominence of this faction. "Less is more", as they say.

[Knight Of Pentacles]

I have to agree.  Watchers get tons of benefits that some application only factions don't.  While I understand "not all factions are equal" and "life isn't fair", so on and so forth; it's kind of ridiculous that there's a faction where people can stand in Freedom's Square for hours collecting decent wages while contributing nothing substantial in return.

[Pandip]

I'm strongly in favor of this. My experience with the Watchers was that there was a lack of direction from PC's that got into it. Seeing as these people are practically lawmakers and they get a pretty substantial wage, letting just about anyone in is a bit disconcerting. Even if Hale put restrictions on the recruitment process, sometimes OOC courtesy saw people getting in a bit too quickly.

The Watchers also get a lot of PC's, but sometimes it feels like they lounge about and act like a fine service reminiscent of the Muster rather than the somewhat elite and disciplined defensive force I think they're meant to be. I'm not saying that someone should write an app the quality of one they'd need to write to play a lycanthrope, but vetting those who get in to make sure they have goal-driven characters that are going to make an affect on the server might help a faction that seems a bit disorganized and lost.

[Bonhomie]

Not all characters need to make an impact, and not all Watchers need to be at the pinnancle of elite example. If there are those that loiter around while silently collecting pay, so be it - players (characters) will soon enough figure out who those are and handle accordingly.

Overall, efu's high level of roleplay should be base enough to play a Watcher properly.

[Tower]

Not all characters need to make an impact, and not all Watchers need to be at the pinnancle of elite example.

While I agree that making Watchers app-only would be a good thing, I'd like to second the above sentiment. It's accepted that goal-driven characters that stir the pot get more DM attention - that's only fair. But sometimes to really change things you need to work outside the system, and that's part of why the faction seems a bit disorganized at times.

Edit: To second what RwG said below, I think another part of the disorganization right now is the fact that all PC leadership was lost within about a week. 3 officer-ranked PCs retired/got forced out in short order and it's something of a vacuum that's hard to fill without either overstepping one's bounds or pestering DMs.

[Random_White_Guy]

I disagree with apps for this, myself.

Law Enforcement is something that can get most new PCs into the server pretty quickly as a way to learn the ropes and otherwise. I fully condone that overly corrupt Watchers should be app required but at the same time they are already -heavily- warned to tell the DMs about their transgressions. Can't swipe fines without telling a DM or big trouble, etc.

All the Watchers have right now is what happens to factions now and then. There's waxes and wanes.

I don't think it's fair to disparage the current watchers on an OOC level. If you want to Icly, by all means go for it. This current watch and the PCs involved though aren't doing anything "Wrong" per-se. The faction is just ripe with opportunity right now.

[MaimedGod]

For clarification, this isn't about current Watchers or to disparage them, it's about the faction in general and a longstanding trend I've noticed. There have been many awesome Watchers, including some currently. :)

[Ebok]

The Watcher faction is everywhere and into everything pretty much by design. This puts a lot of pressure on watchman that are really pushing anything. I think for the most part, those that want this as a full time gig will app for it, and if the circumstances work out, then they'll have a lot of say on who gets into the faction and who doesn't. The amount of commanding authority the officers have (apped) is also not insignificant.

[Kandebyn Olar]

Great powers require great responsability?

APP Only is my vote.

[IRemember]

1.  As a player of a Watchman, I see quite a few players who are new to EFU wind up in the faction.  I think this is a good thing and makes them feel involved.  I think it would be a real shame to make it app-only because lets face it, that will scare off new players from joining.  You might say "But its so easy!"  Any barrier to entry can scare off a new player and I think the server is a far better place that new players could organically and 100% ICly join up.  I am echoing RWGs sentiment 100%.

2.  PC watchers often throw around more weight than they truly have.  Officers have serious power and are app only.  Watchmen really do not have all that much power, if you think they do, they are probably bluffing or exceeding their actual authority.


There are strict "we will delete or ban you" rules for Watcher PCs who are corrupt, with a post on our forum warning that you must keep the DMs aware of all actual corruption or be seriously punished.  I think that handles any OOC concerns.  As far as I know, no player has ever had to ever had to be punished for breaking it.

[granny]

No need to be app only, really.

Maybe put up some guidelines for sergeants to better control the arrival of new members and establish some IC movements towards it, if one truly feels it is needed.

I bet some medals could be created for Watchers with significant achievements in the faction... in order to promote determinate kinds of action.

[Jayde Moon]

No.

"The Watchers are supposed to be a trained and relatively competent force."

If you are relatively competent, you can app for an Officer Position.

That there can be incompetent and bumbling Watchers is by design.

[Moonlighter]

I quite liked how easy it was to get into the faction and start stirring things up.

[Gloinar]

I in fact hate the fact that just anybody can join a faction of law enforcement without any background, or real test of character. It makes room for a lot of frustration on the part of fellow watchers, and people dealing with them. I would be all for applying for this faction, however. That way there is some clarity.

[Battle Beetles]

I have always seen the Watchers as vaguely Discworld-esque incompetents lead by competent officer ranks.  I believe it might take away from the general "theme" of the faction to make even the lowest grunt rank app-only.  

The current entry process also serves to ensure that, by virtue of having a minimum amount of "OOC" hoops to jump through, Sanctuary rarely suffers from a dearth of Watchers.  And the Upper setting (at least in my opinion) would be dreadfully boring without at least a few of them, incompetent or not.

If there is a concern with the way non-app position Watchers are played, then it falls to their IC PC superiors to handle that- If it doesn't already exist, maybe Sergeants/Inspectors could be encouraged by some means to take on "internal affairs" style duties to keep their underlings in line in an IC manner.