Rage and the Half Orc

[Noob]

So yesterday I was sitting down, contemplating the next character I was going to roll and I immediately thought 'why not half-orc barbarian! I like barbarians, I like half-orcs!' only to have realized that this would be a painful effort to try to capitalize on favoured class, for the following reasons:

- stats are weighed differently on efu than in standard dnd; Mentally below 10 you're considered paste eating, socially you're considered shut-in/monstrous. Because of that redistribution if you want an orc that knows you sit on a couch as opposed to eat it, you need to sink more points in than common to get to the efu 'norm' - which absolutely negates that bonus strength.

- key feature tied to barbarians, is rage - which on efu  is penalized on half-orcs by being tied to charisma. With barb being a favoured class for them, this is kinda a double kick to the junk.  


Now, currently, unless you're dropping 6's in your attribute array like a madman, half-orcs are like the opposite of dwarves - they're a pure flavour race and the only real reason to lean that way is rp, and if you do lean that way when the choice comes between barb or fighter you're honestly better off stapling some furs onto your fullplate and just being really angry in your emotes - which I suppose is manageable but really just not quite the same.


Suggestiony Bit:  If its possible, make half-orc's charisma considered +2 higher only for the purpose of dealing with rage bonuses: It's hardly a broken good race, +2 charisma in that purpose does nothing to aid them in other roles (exclusively incentive not to go tank fighter), and while it does nothing overall to make the race 'better' it surely opens up at least one class to them a bit more.

[Vlaid]

If you drop strength by the same amount your race raises it by, and raise charisma by the same amount, you end up with a race with no modifier to strength or charisma (basically), if you're wanting higher charisma as a barbarian. Seems like a fair trade if that's what you want, no?

[Noob]

You end up with a race with -2 intelligence, and darkvision, in the end.  If you even out Str/Cha (and your cha is going to come at a premium for over 12); I could type in the other modifiers for every single, better, race in default nwn (which are -better- before the considerations unique to nwn tbh) but honestly if you just check out the chargen screen it's pretty obvious half-orc is pretty low bar - and their primary 'bonus', strength, dissapears if you try to up charisma (especially past 12).  I'd argue thats kinda against the intent, of them having favoured barbarian and more or less something purely brought about by the changes to rage.

[Pandip]

This is like saying that half-elves should get +2 DEX to make up for the fact that they don't get any of the good bonuses from either of their respective parents.

Half-orcs don't need to be barbarians. They also don't need to have charisma. Or strength. You could easily have a half-orc with ten strength. If anything, I think it would be more fun to play a half-orc that doesn't fit the norm of 18-20 strength fighter or barbarian with a greataxe.

[Kotenku]

I respect this Pro-Kodax Haun initiative.

What you're looking at is a half-orc barbarian with, let's say, 16 STR and 8 CHA. Okay. When raging, this barbarian gets +3 STR, bringing it to 19. Compare to a Half-orc Barbarian with 18 STR and 6 CHA, who when raging who when raging gets +2 STR bringing his total to 20.

17 STR, 8 CHA: +3 STR, 20 while raged.
14 STR, 12 CHA, +5 STR (at level 4) is still only 19, but the point is this can be buffed considerably through spells like Aura of Glory and Eagle's Splendor, not to mention other less common pieces of equipment which can bring the bonus much closer to that +8.

What you're basically looking at for half-orcs is a -1 rage bonus which is traded off for a constant +2. I don't think half-orcs are hurting mechanically, but I sympathize with players who try to play them anyway. Playing an Half-Orc is an exercise in masochism for entirely separate reasons than their ability scores.

[Noob]

First, while I'm sure 10 strength half orc non-fighter, non-barbarian could be interesting its not really the point; Fighters, rogues and sorcerers could all be interesting prior to perks, I still think including perks was a good idea to draw more players to straightclassing those classes rather than splashing a level here and there - this was more to raise the point that the class which the race -favours- they are exceptionally bad at (largely because of changes out of the norm);  And while half elves are also not really a mechanically 'awesome' race  they're kinda a neutral draw overall with no stat penalties, or bonuses, the lack of a feat and reduced skillpoints arguably a horrid trade for what benefits the race gets - but in no way would I say they're 'half-orc bad' >.> without even digging into the social angle that playing one leaves you fairly despised ic.


Secondly, while I'm fairly certain a half orc barbarian would be fairly balanced whether you go strength or charisma (to 12 at least), I think the real comparison would be a half orc barbarian compared to a half-orc fighter (as an example of that race put to a class thats remarkably common to them now, rather than their favoured) or human (baseline) barbarian. For the first you have better armour, less divided stats, better feat progression (+specialization), at the cost of a rage you're never going to do -that- well without massive cash investment (and resources aren't an endless element here really), an average +1 hp per level, and a slight boost in skillpoints; And for the other you have pretty much the exact same starting stats after upping charisma/intelligence to the point where under the view of attributes here you're not considered braindead and you're down a feat and skillpoints.

Obviously a class doesn't need to be suited to your race to play it, but ultimately theres a real limit on the number of half-orc wizards I've seen running around lately - which does kinda demonstrate that people have some interest in being mechanically viable, or see being mechanically viable not necessarily being exclusive of interesting rp.  This suggestion was mostly to open up the favoured class, and archtype associated with half orcs really, to perhaps being more of a draw from the mechanics side.

[Relinquish]

You don't have to use rage to ennjoy barbarian. You will still enjoy the 10-20% movement speed the 10-20% DI, and a d12 HD class. And even if you do rage with 6 charisma and 20 strength, you are still stronger than other barbarians raging with charisma.

(Not mentioning you can drink those eagles spleandor potions that no one takes from quests)

[Gippy]

Relinquish has crunched the numbers. Less con but equal strenth in rage... and more strength the rest of the time.

Half-orcs though, are indeed simply not very good. Alas. DM loot sometimes finds its way to the deserving.