Lower PvP

[Random_White_Guy]

While I understand the desire to ensure that "Free Lower PvP" doesn't occur again there's still a degree of concern that I have growing from the situations I see.

In Upper Sanctuary PvP is required because it is assumed the large presence of lawful NPCs would stop it. IF you PvP in upper with a DM there's usually NPC involvement, etc. However if you PvP in lower with a DM present it is almost solely NPCs making some one line emote, not intervening, while just lingering about watching the fight happen.

Lower Sanctuary is supposed to be dangerous. It's supposed to be violent. However without DM presence Lower basicsally becomes Upper 2.0 with PCs just getting along, PCs from upper with rings just coming down to spy or sip ale or slum it with outlaws, and similar situations.

The presence NPCs in Lower Sanctuary upon the street are mostly non-existent in terms of plot, IC activities and similar.  Would it be possible to reduce them to the point where PVP can once again occur within Lower's streets and alleys?

I understand the Crone having a no brawling policy. I understand the Market being a place in which trading is done and order is kept. Just as the Temple of Hoar would have NPCs to keep the "Riff-raff" out. These areas with NPCs having a requirement of DM for PVP is legitimate and wholly understandable.

The rest of Lower though I feel suffers vastly with the decline of DM presence turning it into Upper v2. PCs loitering along the main street having the time of their life just leaves a sour taste.

The streets of lower aren't something people are afraid to walk because 9/10 times there's not a DM present for it to be dangerous. And to me I feel that is wholly opposite of  EFU's mantra of PCs acting without need of DM handholding or DMs pushing plots.

With fewer NPCs on the streets and PvP (Even if it's just "Subdual and robbing, No FD in Lower" style of rules) it would allow Lower to become a sandbox once more as PCs stake up turf, start gangs, and similar. Cults, gangs, and other elements that make Lower so fun are basically hamstrung with irregular DM presence.

Just a suggestion but having recently played a gang-oriented PC without a DM it is almost impossible to make any type of legitimate gang action and leads to a lot of thumb twiddling.

[RagingPurpleGiant]

This is an interesting idea.

[MaximumOverDrive]

strongly approve, lower feels safe, and that just feels wrong. Lower should be a pvp zone, yet i feel it shouldn't lose it's npc presence either.. So much would-be conflict that doesn't happen because it's more along the lines of going ooc //hey let me get a DM first, if we can, otherwise we have to move somewhere else, even if that isn't ICly  fitting// which I find too meta in itself.

[Verk]

Whilst I haven't played a lower based pc yet I'd be all for pvp being allowed in lower without a DM if it wasn't FD.

[HalflingPower]

I agree that lower should be a full pvp zone, with the npcs having moved into the canal ward I feel that its choking the life out of Lower Sanctuary as far as fun conflict goes. I would be all for full pvp in the streets of lower, including FD because whats the risk if you cant die?

[Blue41]

Certainly don't need any NPC's in the alleys.

[snot_rocket]

Free PvP is asking for trouble.  You should always need a DM to FD a character, in my opinion.  I do wish there was less rift-raft on the streets and more building utilization.

[Kinslayer988]

I agree with RwG in that none of the NPCs in the main lowers area truly care for most of them unless it was Winston or whatnot.

[The Holy Goat]

I like npcs standing around, and think that removing them for the sake of being able to pvp without an npc is akin to emptying the streets to turn lower into an arena. The issue as I see it is that certain locations within the same zone are "protected" by different organisations, and there is nothing really stopping someone from running to a protected area to escape non DM pvp.

With the Market protected by the Silver Brands, the stairwell by Winston, the Elf camp, etc. they might not care if you mug someone, but they would most likely care that you are doing it on their turf. The only solution I could think of would be allowing non FD pvp only through the alleys and pump house adjacent, and having it stop if you reach a gang's turf. How that will not spill out into the other parts of Lower I don't know.

If you want to try and mug someone that close to potential protections you'll have to be quick. I just don't think removing npcs is the right solution.

[Ban]

I'm all for Free PvP in Lower. It is a free place anyway and most NPCs wouldn't care about fights. But I can't see too far about the consequences that this could escalate, so I guess it is DM supervision only for a good reason. And yes, I miss when the Docks surroundings were a free PvP Place.

[VanillaPudding]

I like the suggestion. I dislike the random idea suddenly floating around that you should need a DM to FD characters. If you or others are playing in a fitting manner for the server then you definitely do not need to be babysat by a DM for such things.

[granny]

How would you solve the mess of darkness/ grease/ evards or whatever other AoE spell hitting an NPC?

[MetallicSlime]

Needs dms or setting altering plot stuffs to do I think.

[Reremouse Argent]

Well, in terms of setting-altering plot stuff being required...