OOC in PvP

[Aethereal]

Most people on EfU will hardly ever FD, even if they are some major villain, and when it comes to looting they tend not to take anything nearing a crippling amount (though sometimes they do), and especially not from random folks.

What most people do is irrelevant and such general statements hold a limited basis for accuracy. What you do, is everything.

The most important factor is that you, the player, are respectful to your fellow player. A big part of this is putting yourself in the shoes of your victim if you are the winner, or in the position of the winner if you are loser and understanding that both of you must gain something from this interaction.

You must understand that cooperation is the key to making the experience enjoyable for all involved, and that it has to be meaningful, or else it should be reconsidered. We are not replicating the real world here where a mass murderer might simply gun down unsuspecting civilians without them ever knowing why. This type of act (i.e. 'I'm gonna FD kill you and take all your loot, even though I do not know, you do not know me and you did nothing except be a PC who walked into the crossroads to earn this.') should never be perpetrated against PCs. It is perfectly fine to do so against kobold tribes, goblin granary invaders and other varying NPC outlets for homicidal rage! And when you do so with other PCs, show some of your homicidal nature through RP and dialogue! Or not, depending on the PC.

Making something meaningful is complicated, but it is the very essence of what we are doing through our roleplay (and seemingly enjoying throughout the process!)

The primary issue for PvP initiators / winners (assassin, monster, bandit or any other kind of PvP heavy / criminal concept) is that you cannot act only for your own PC's gain without giving something back to those from whom you take.

You can give something back very easily, the currencies available are many and are limited mostly by your imagination (if you are thinking of your limitations by mechanics, you are so badly limiting yourself that it makes a kitten weep.)

Among the possibilities, it can and ideally always should include narrative: revealing why your PC is doing this through roleplay and dialogue. E.g. as a drug addict pilfers gold, they might reveal signs of withdrawal, "Pappa / Mama's gonna get a whole lot of lovin' tonight."

As for the victim, though it applies to everyone as well, this:

[INDENT]

TBH being chill is THE most important trait, bar none.

As a player who has basically been the victim in every single PvP encounter I have had (except that one time, I suppose), the most valuable and productive trait to help overcome the situation is being calm. ShadowCharlatan says it best.[/INDENT]

For folks considering concepts, keep in mind you can give / take anything from other PCs, ranging from the material: gold & loot; mental: pride, sense of safety etc; physical: blood, body part, life; intangible: servitude, virginity, and many more, just use your mind creatively. (Yes, one of those was added in jest.)

Finally, do not make the mistake of picking your victims indiscriminately and FD killing them without building up a meaningful conflict or prelude. I have had the experience of having a character lured out to an ambiguous location, to be sacrificed in some necromantic ritual without knowing the PCs involved or that anything of this nature was going to take place. Thankfully, after DM consultation, we resolved the issue to allow for a much more acceptable experience and I believe those involved have learnt from their mistakes. Regardless, it was neither a fun, nor interesting initial experience. If you do have such a concept, please ensure you roleplay with your potential victims way before FD time, giving hints to intent, ideally building a rivalry before following through with such a plot.

TL;DR

Respect, just a little bit.

[HalflingPower]

Respect others and hope to be respected.

Aethereal, this is the correct video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rZs8ZKTsp0


PEPSI FOR ALL

[River Walker]

I just want to say that I've been in numerous PvP and near-PvP situations (haven't won one yet, sadly) and I have never had this problem with other players. No one has ever gloated or used excessive force.

I have seen some instances where I thought the player's frustrations were driving the actions of the character, which is about as much fun as watching someone argue with their spouse. Other than that, I don't think this is any kind of epidemic.

[AKMatt]

"Losing" with grace is one of the coolest things a player can do, in my opinion.  Obviously there needs to be grace in victory as well, but it really is disheartening to see people break character just because they have been subdued.

If I see people roleplay a defeated victim well, it usually earns a substantial RP XP bonus, and definitely makes their character stand out on the rare occasions when I decide I'd like to make a thematic quest with loot potential for a PC or group of PCs.

[Sternhund]

I'm sad this is an issue! If you spot particularly bad sportsmanship, feel free to take screenshots and give us a heads up.

[winter_is_coming]

I actually don't understand the need to send ANY tells, whichever way, after a PvP.

[The Old Hack]

It can be legitimate sometimes. Polite queries as to whether a DM was/is present, compliments on a fight and tense situation well resolved, but yes -- in general terms I agree. Certainly insults, complaints about your IC behavior (usually translating into "you didn't follow my script!") and gloating are far beyond the pale.

[wcsherry]

Learning to lose with grace is the mark of a distinguished player, the kind everyone will want to be around - this includes DM's and players.

Gaining this quality can  be difficult to master and those of you struggling with it have my sympathies, but understand, that it is not impossible to overcome.

[Softie]

Begging for your life is a good thing to do in these situations, when you're subdued.

This is an excellent tip and one I would like to highlight.  A lot of the time people act like the ultra brave hero, which is fine if it is your character.  Ultra brave heroes who back talk might not get mercy.

If you grovel and beg ICly, if it fits for your character, there is a very good chance you can survive and just work for them, or possibly be sent off with some sort of disfigurement or warning.

I guess what I am saying is, give cowardice a chance!  I think a lot of people over look this.

[Akrasia]

This is pure thread necromancy, but I have to say, since posting this request/suggestion to this forum, I haven't noticed a blind bit of difference.

In the interim, I've suffered two FDKs, one of which was perma, and I just shut up, did not communicate with the people who beat me, and got on with it irrespective of any private complaint I may or may not have had: so why is that, while I'm expected to swallow FDKs with reasonable frequency, in every single instance of PvP I've gotten into since posting, in which I've just tried to sub someone's PC, has it descended immediately into OOC complaining?

What more can I say that hasn't been said already to try to convince people to stop whining at me when I attack their character?

It is frustrating because it's ruining this game for me and I just don't feel like I can PvP anymore.

I've taken screenshots of the kind of rudeness players exhibit toward me but it's so pathetic and so petty and so unnecessary that I even feel silly bothering DMs to email them about it: but it's specifically this small-minded pettiness that so badly ruins the game.

For the last time, please, please stay in character, at least to me, when I hit your PC. Tell your friends if you think I'm an asshole, tell a DM if you think I'm cheating, just say nothing to me.

[HalflingPower]

Ive actually had a guy feign afking so he could try and avoid getting mugged and then raged at me in tells the moment I subdued him.

It can be pretty bad brother.

[Marlin Silice]

This is an excellent tip and one I would like to highlight.  A lot of the time people act like the ultra brave hero, which is fine if it is your character.  Ultra brave heroes who back talk might not get mercy.

If you grovel and beg ICly, if it fits for your character, there is a very good chance you can survive and just work for them, or possibly be sent off with some sort of disfigurement or warning.

I guess what I am saying is, give cowardice a chance!  I think a lot of people over look this.

I learned i could get away from death, XP loss, drylooting by pathetically pleading for mercy and acting like a coward when the situation calls for it. Got one of my characters VERY far- in all honestly the "not looking badass" is worth it.

[Halfbrood]

Akrasia; I urge you to share those screenshots held with DMs. However small, it is causing you to hate the game and should be investigated.