Electric Traps-

[Equinox]

Electrical traps over moderate levels are stupidly OP and have no place in a setting where 70hp is considered average.

These traps are designed for high level servers... despite all this, how the hell are a group of random mobs getting them in this case? They are crazy complicated to make, and unpurchaseable.

 Though I personally have not died from one on a scripted quest. The only place they belong is on hard ass dm quests. you shouldnt need an optimal party for every quest.

[Talir]

I have yet to see an electrical trap on a quest that cannot be avoided. Play it smart and careful, and it's no problem.

[Winston Martin]

But ONE MISTAKE and you can land an entire party in the fugue.

If you are referring to the instance when Tower of Mercy curb stomped us, my PC - as well as several others in the front - had said IC where it was safe to step and gave several warnings about the traps. My PC has Search 4.

Communication is difficult in large groups, and that was why half the party got killed to that electrical trap.

[Letsplayforfun]

Damn, traps that kill -no, knock out - people. What next?

Seriously. Traps or very dangerous spawns just part of the setting. It's lack of communication, lack of organization, and lack of using consummables "just to make sure" that are party killers.

Play every quest as if were a DM quest, like you should, and there's little issue.

If someone made a mistake and triggered that wire, wake up from the knock out and size the RP opportunity. Grumble, threaten, insult, beat down (hum, not in QA...), kick out from party, threaten to kick the incompetent out of a faction, deprive of loot sharing, make fun of, pardon, teach, coach...

[Thomas_Not_very_wise]

Winston, i was referring to the new Iron Nails quest. One person stepped on it. The Fugue Loaded for three people of levels 6 and higher.

All I would like is for the dms to consider more prudently the type of traps they put in at least. These traps cause only grief, and have a high probability of getting someone killed.

[DollarPhil]

These traps cause only grief, and have a high probability of getting someone killed.

In before "that's what traps DO".

The point is they can kill you from nowhere, through someone else's mistake, with no warning. If you prepare for every eventuality for huge damage on every quest you'll soon not *have* any supplies because you used up all the good ones just in case. If instead you get paranoid of careless players exploding half your team, you just fuel elitism. I'd take an inexperienced player on a quest when it could put us at a bit of a disadvantage, but not if I knew that if they were careless, we'd all be losing levels.

There's no good response to sudden Electric Death like for say the Epic Spike Trapped endchest on a certain quest, or not bothering to use consumables against powerful bosses. If you can't say after a fuguing "Well, sucks to be me, I really should have done X", it's not a failed challenge, it's just a frustrating experience. Worse than the Bodak, TBH. That will screw you up royally if someone doesn''t pay attention, but you can see it ahead and there are multiple ways to safely kill it or avoid it even if you didn't bring a L7 Cleric or Captain Willsave. That trap, well you need a disabler to at least examine it. A search won't do, because if you detect it and sent in a Suicide Summon, the backblast will likely hit you too.

[Mort]

Is a death penalty of 1/3 xp fun?

Are crits from monsters fun?

Are death spells fun?

If we remove 1, should we remove all?

[DollarPhil]

Is a death penalty of 1/3 xp fun?

The death penalty's a consequence of another action, and not frustrating in itself, but a reason for lame fuguings to be annoying and players to be careful.

Are crits from monsters fun?

No, but you learn to expect them and plan ahead (don't let the Berzerkers tag team you, kill that bastard with a scythe fast, if it's wielding a rapier, be ready to spam healing). Usually going from full health->fugue is a rare occurrence caused by double or triple crits. Serious poor luck, not fixable design.

Are death spells fun?

No, but PHK's easily blockable with PFX, L9 clerics/druids should be rarer now, and if you know something has deathspells (like a Bodak) you can use a Deathward item. Plus they are generally single target, so except for PHK invis ganks, you put yourself in the line of fire for them.

If we remove 1, should we remove all?

Do not Reductio ad absurdum me, sir :P. There's a difference between "remove stuff that can kill a fairly cautious PC from out of nowhere" and "Reduce all enemies to shuriken-wielding 6 STR Kobolds".

[Thomas_Not_very_wise]

Mort, I am the guy who is advocating that Heroes should be using Stone skin and absolute haste potions. -.-

I would suggest an alternative to this trap- instead of a massive dose of damage, I suggest it applies a level 5 chain lightning 3 times. This way you could potentially be hit for 30 dmg each time, but you also have the risk of making a save.

90 dmg in one trap will overload many a protection from elements and well, leave you in the fugue.

[DeputyCool]

If you cannot handle the difficulty level of the quest, do not do it. The quest was designed to be what it is.

There is no rule that says we have to make every single quest to be doable by everyone.

[Mort]

Well, everything you said can be applied to traps...

 - Take time to walk.
 - Have a scout.
 - Send one of your 'allies' to go in first.
 - Have proper protection spells.

[Howlando]

Calculor was quite adamant that he wanted an electrical trap on his first new quest. I believe the NPC says that the Iron Nails gang are renowned for their skill with traps.

Bringing a rogue and actually scouting for once, instead of just laughing at traps, would therefore seem an appropriate tactic on this quest.