The Balance of EFU:A

[derfo]

While not having a Spellguard/Conclave PC ever I can't say I can really judge, but I can say the consort system seems pretty involving, and the fact that the stereotype is not expected to be the terse LE Spellguard agent seems to be definitely cool for conflict. Kudos on all that.

As far as Garem's note of the mirror of docks and colony factions, that seems to be pretty well done too. There's churches here and churches there. There's the gangs and the noble houses, the Sons and the Stygians, while still each side has a more distinct and fleshed out way of things.

While this might be taken as more out of self-interest, I'd think having the shops opened up in the docks would definitely help the population dispersion, but realize that needs some time. Slight price fluctuations/differences can have a huge impact on how people and therefore get into more conflict as well. Even the Conclave could use some public accommodations to draw some traffic, maybe.

[Pup]

I'm not too sure what you're even talking about Pup to be honest. Anyway, nothing in this thread is a complaint about how things are or even a true suggestion on how things might change. It's just here as a discussion on the factions and their interaction -outside of direct conflict-. !

Even when I'm extemporaneous, I still usually fail to be clear.  For that I apologize.

I know Fleeting Heart got me, though.  There is a HUGE opportunity for players right now.  The delicate balance amongst the current factions is ripe for the plucking.  If I wasn't enjoying my current char so much I would leap in head-first.  But I am taking it slow for now, and just enjoying the server without huge goals or "awesome" concepts.

*throws down the guantlet*

I know this strays from the OP (Sorry, Vanilla), but I KNOW IT IS OUT THERE>>>

[SkillFocuspwn]

I do agree with derf that, playing a majority Docks character, the situation is pretty unappealing a lot of the time. Apart from outlaws and Sons, every PC, including the PCs who would normally be in the Docks, simply chills in the Ziggurat due to there being nothing but a few quests in the Docks, which in turn creates the ghost town atmosphere I've always seen there.

Basically, what I'm saying is the only PCs who really spend any time in the Docks are those who do PvP against the Stygians / Colony regularly, which makes it feel very much like a war camp where almost every other PC who would otherwise be there just goes to the Ziggurat for convenience.

Shops and more quests would help this, but the DMs are on that anyways. Otherwise, I do know what you mean for a lot of this, but there will always be problems and these are relatively minor in comparison to a lot of other times on EfU.

[Gippy]

I do believe that the docks has nearly as many quests as the Ziggurat, (maybe more?) with the exception of a lowbie circuit, which should be rectified. It does not have a sending system. It is sort of a tediously large / slow design.

[Garem]

Basically, what I'm saying is the only PCs who really spend any time in the Docks are those who do PvP against the Stygians / Colony regularly, which makes it feel very much like a war camp where almost every other PC who would otherwise be there just goes to the Ziggurat for convenience.

This is waaay largely due to the current IG climate, I think. It's really dangerous for PCs to be around the Docks. People perceive, be it IC or OOCly, that many of the prevalent Dock PCs right now are as likely to mug you as help you. They are naturally repelled by this.

TBH, needs another Fleur or someone like it or this isn't going to change. PC action is required to make the Docks more lucrative for adventurers, and the ziggurat less attractive because quite simply the Stygian/Law-and-Order PCs have created an IG environment around the ziggurat that is much better for PCs to exist in, and the Sons/Chaos-and-Anarchy PCs have created an IG environment that repels them.

[SkillFocuspwn]

There I disagree, having spoken to a lot of players and seen it myself, a lot of people who are "tough enough" to hang in the Docks simply don't because there's never anyone around to chat with and, if you want to do questing, it's simply much easier to arrange it all at the Ziggurat.

[derfo]

I've never seen someone mugged in the docks. I think most PvP has been decently reasonable.

I'll probably get shit for this comparison, but Lower was pretty reasonably populated a lot of time, as far as I could tell. People consistently had a reason to go there for shops. I don't really fault the design of the docks, no one decides not to go there saying to themselves "UGH IT'S SO CLUNKY TO LOOK AT THE DOCKS." Nor do I think lowbie quests there would do anything besides make low level characters run from quest to quest there for awhile in addition to the zigguraut ones. I guess the lack of sendings doesn't help, but it isn't a huge deal.

Anyways, it might be a cyclical thing. Occasional crowds are drawn to the docks and it's cool. I'm not insanely distressed or anything.

[UrkoNeedsAStiffDrink]

The IC reputation of the docks created by the playerbase only adds to the spice that the GM/DMs intended the docks atmosphere to be. Ofcourse there are times when its a ghost town, whether thats down to a lack of quests/merchants/sendings, that only shows that the playerbase is lured to places with better gains (XP, GP and loot) than those with possibly better atmosphere.

Not that I'm saying anyones powergaming, but its human nature.

[Nihm]

I disagree with Gippy about the quests - there are some for the 3-6 level range, but only one for the higher level range, and that one has to be triggered from the ziggurat.
 
Besides a few errand quests the docks should have one higher level quest comparable to the Stygian Armada one - perhaps a quest to ambush a slaver caravan or ship?

[Barehander]

The sending issue is the major one, really: if you want to get something going outside of the crowd in the immediate vicinity, you have to go to the Zig. And that's where people are, so it's common to stick around and gather a crowd there. I guess the shops are a bit of an issue too, but I don't have to shop all too often.

All in all, however, I don't think it's much of an issue with the design. People will always hang out somewhere, and it's quite natural to go to where the most people are if there are no obstacles. The most people implies the most RP opportunities, roughly speaking.

[Gwydion]

There are a few PCs that do spend a decent amount of time in the Docks and the Wastrel specifically that are not part of the Sons and/or do not PvP the Stygians and other Pcs often.

Opening up some of those specialty shops might bring some PCs to the Docks more often and encourage more RP and interaction.

Especially if there are some highly sought after consumables that can be bought there for a decent price.

[derfo]

derailment complete

[Semli]

I'll probably get shit for this comparison, but Lower was pretty reasonably populated a lot of time, as far as I could tell. People consistently had a reason to go there for shops.

Lower had the only local NPC smith I believe after the duergar left. There were also deliveries heading into Lower, and what's more, there were actually merchants there. Once the shops actually open (in particular, the hides merchant I think) both camps should at least become self-sufficient. I think the thing that ultimately kept Lower alive though was the fact that Upper needed it, both in terms of things that affected PCs and also background plots. The Duchy certainly appears to exist entirely without the need for the Docks and the Docks district will remain a ghost town until all those shops open. Provided each camp has its own merchants and no need for the other, we will get the chance to see some nice red vs. blue if not regain what was EFU. Things change though so I really don't see it as being a bad thing.

As far as the original post goes, factions seem cooler now with more shades of gray and less overlapping authority, so keep them as they are. While I realize for an entire dongstorm of reasons we'll never get to play in Old Port, I find myself thinking I'd be more interested in that and leaving the Ziggurat some uber dungeon for PC excursions. Maybe it would get boring after awhile, but to be fair, even the most interesting setting will get boring after awhile (see EFU).