The addition of scripted trade routes throughout Ymph and the archipelago offer the possibility of an alternative (of sorts) to questing when a party cannot be found, all the while encouraging PCs to leave Kingsman's doorstep or the Docks square and providing for conflict between trading parties and bandits, natives or other antagonistic parties.
I envision these routes as mini-quests available to multiple PCs of all levels; essentially, they are more elaborate "fetch" quests that would provide minimal XPs and utilitarian supplies (healing potions, commonly-used combat potions like insulation and blurring) with a possibility for some genuinely useful loot as well (like the rewards for turning in salvaged knick-knacks and rat meat), perhaps upon passing an Appraise check with merchant NPCs to represent your PC having bartered up for the supplies. For example:
- A route from the Exile's Camp to the Docks, supplying food.
- A route from the ore mine in the mountains to Tobar in the Dominion / Munt in the Docks, supplying metal.
- A route from the Argenti camp in the Desert to Kingsman's, supplying (Realmsian equivalents of) frankincense and myrrh.
These are all passingly dangerous trips, and would provide opportunities for brigands and highwaymen that don't involve ambushing whole companies of adventurers preparing for quests.
Care would need to be taken to ensure that lone, invisibility-using PCs cannot abuse these quests. I would suggest loading them down with very heavy trade goods to encumber a single PC, and make traveling in a well-armed group necessary.
Finally, perhaps the information could be tagged into EFUSL for DMs to see data on, and act on this information to change the gameworld, reward diligent PCs, think of plots, and so on.
I really like this idea.
More incentive for people to go places different from the norm around the server is always a good idea.
I like this a lot.
Sounds good, I like the idea of any level being involved. Would be fun.
Do this!
This was suggested a while back if I recall. I thought it was a good idea then and it's still a good idea now.
If it is made so that the load is carried by an ox rather than the PC, we avoid stealthers from abusing super stealth to do this without any risk. If the ox is made somehow that it can't be made invisible, mages will not be able to abuse invisibility, but still be able to use it.
Probably one of the best quest related ideas I've read in a long time.
I say we go for this.
If thise could be done in a way that didn't railroad players into making hard earned abilities useless by way of strangely invisible proof oxen and stuff like that. It's one thing to find a counter for something, it's another to simply devise arbitrary ways to negate abilities.
Technically, apart from the party support do you foresee this as being different from a regular delivery?
/Doesn't build quests.
Yus. Plus I think a slow-moving ox would be enough, without needing to make it immune to invisibility. If someone wants to cast enough invis spells from A to B, so be it. If the ox dies, the chars can then carry the goods themselves. Sounds pretty sweet to me.
I can't help but shake the feeling that this is a horrible idea. I don't really have anything concrete, but this could throw up so many problems: lag, exploits, farming, camping, you know, all the gaming term things we don't really want to see.
How about just putting in a 'trade' merchant who sells a unique item and somewhere on the island is someone who will buy that item for just a touch more than you bought it for? It doesn't have to be a 'quest' per se. Just make sure the buyer and seller are far enough apart that it's not an easy journey and that the items are heavy enough that you can't carry too much of it without being encumbered.
This really opens things up for banditry and the like. I can literally attack your merchant 'caravan' and steal your... bags of flour, and then attempt to sell them to the original merchant at a discount or complete the trade route and steal your investment AND your profit.
But this way you are actually making an INVESTMENT in the items you are moving.
Shit, you could even create an item that weighs enough to encumber even a 30 str character. To get it, you invest 1000 gp. Buyer at the other end of the chain buys it for 3000. While you have it, your move silent skill is lowered by... 10 or 15 (it's hard to move that big thing silently). Anyone could carry it.
A 2000 gp profit allows you to actually hire guards and the like for your slow journey across the island. For 2000 gp, a bandit PC might actually feel inclined to try to gather his fellows and rob you, killing of your guard. Experience is simply earned on the way.
Since it's not a 'quest' any level PC can be involved.
Just a thought on how you could implement the intent of the OP without adding it as a 'quest'
I think Oligarch wants a return of the old ore quest that used to start in the abandoned mine near Orcs Part 2. There was a "pile of ore" that acted as a quest placeable, giving the delivery to everyone nearby and loading the PC who took the quest with an Ore item weighing about 30 lbs. All the areas Oligarch mentioned are loaded with Cheesy Unavoidable Invis Dispel Traps (tm) on the route anyway. Make the item weigh 40 lbs or so, and a sneaker would have to prepare and lose a lot of carry weight or get buffed. Lone PCs could be blocked with a minimum party size 2, but I don't see why there's this feeling of 'anything other than fighting is exploiting'. I'd rather see more quests that could be defeated with guile rather than force. Unlike regular deliveries this would be long-range, difficult and potentially high level, involving negotiating dangerous areas of the server to complete. It would function similar to fedex quests in providing a lower risk quest option with limited rewards. This would be good as it would give higher level PCs that aren't in quest crush teams something to do, as it would not require an optimal team.
Sorry for double post:
The GP amounts above are just as an example.
Concerns: Buying 50 of the overweight boxes knowing that carrying 5 or 50 is no difference in your movement rate.
Purchasing an item, roaming the server, then selling the item should not produce any appreciable lag.
Farming the 'trade route', the point is that it should be an arduoud enough route that you cannot easily and quickly just run back and forth doing this. It should be take an hour or two to complete. Doing it without some sort of party should be a suicide run.
This doesn't work for something like moving small consumables to the Exile Camp (and really... can they honestly not find someone to just go get what they need from the ziggurat anyway?) This is for over the Mountains of Mist type stuff. Into the desert type stuff.
Quote from: Iron Oligarch;191271These are all passingly dangerous trips, and would provide opportunities for brigands and highwaymen that don't involve ambushing whole companies of adventurers preparing for quests.
Finally, perhaps the information could be tagged into EFUSL for DMs to see data on, and act on this information to change the gameworld, reward diligent PCs, think of plots, and so on.
Yes please.
Kinda like this idea, especially when it brings people to wander the server instead of standing at the typical places, group up, quest, go back, rest, stand in typical place.
I actually really like the idea as well as getting people exploring it provides a ton of RP potential. Merchants organise caravans and hiring mercenaries who are actually doing mercenary job work. PC bandits with interesting targets to hit rather than just looting peoples gold/potions. On that note if this was implemented a secret "Black Market" dealer for goods would be cool if criminals and bandits robbed caravans they'd need somewhere to sell.
I will bump this with an additional suggestion: smuggling runs for criminals to undertake, and law enforcers to stop. As an example:
- Taking illicit Mist-related substances from Gull Rock to a "pusher" camped in the sewers beneath the Dominion.
And, in response to Snoteye whose post I missed:
Quote from: "Snoteye"Technically, apart from the party support do you foresee this as being different from a regular delivery?
/Doesn't build quests.
Apart from the party support and lack of a level restriction, not particularly. The major difference between these "trade route" quests and "delivery" quests is the distance between the starting and ending points, as well as the increased danger that one encounters between them and the larger reward one would get for completing them.
Jayde Moon's suggestion is another valid option, but I am not certain if the shop's gold cap could be increased for specific items. If it could not, one would have to buy twenty, thirty knick-knacks at a time; this would clutter up PC inventories and be a pain to unload at a shop. It is still a reasonable suggestion that might involve a good bit less work than setting up quests, however.
Tried this.
Region to defend for resources.
Bringing resources (ore) from the mountain to the city.
Most people didn't bother or they did when no one was on, or it was just lame and boring.
Lots of problem with it or how people will treat it in general. I did picture in my head lots of awesome scenarios that people could do without any DM but there needs to be -clear- incentive for and against these trade routes beforehand and lots of scripting must be done for it to work.
It can't be done with simplicity if you want it to work the way you envision this and I doubt anyone at the moment is willing to script this, so good idea, but not feasible in the foreseable future.
Quote from: Mort;193360Tried this.
Region to defend for resources.
Bringing resources (ore) from the mountain to the city.
Most people didn't bother or they did when no one was on, or it was just lame and boring.
Lots of problem with it or how people will treat it in general. I did picture in my head lots of awesome scenarios that people could do without any DM but there needs to be -clear- incentive for and against these trade routes beforehand and lots of scripting must be done for it to work.
It can't be done with simplicity if you want it to work the way you envision this and I doubt anyone at the moment is willing to script this, so good idea, but not feasible in the foreseable future.
There's a reason why the defendable regions are not used. There's little visible benefit to it.
Now, if defending these regions gave a minor income to all factions members, say, 2 gold every IG hour...
It's not just that. IMO the thing is that it is not very amusing to defend them. You walk in, click a placeable, then walk out. By defending you mean defending them from other factions who are vicously trying to... er.. defend it too.
Perhaps if when reaching the area, you had to clear a large amount of enemies to actually be able to claim it, and ocacionally, enemies would invade teh area again and you got a message like "You've lost controll of X area" etc...
Quote from: Staring Death;193363There's a reason why the defendable regions are not used. There's little visible benefit to it.
This.
I controlled the farms for several weeks, and formed a faction around defending it, and saw no benefit at all. In the end it just got boring and tedious to control a region that gave no benefit, would randomly be taken away by a lone wolf spawning somewhere in the area, and other 3 person factions would just randomly take and ignore.
Running stuff from one place to another seems more interesting, because you're not defending a flag somewhere, but moving from place to place. It may have been boring to chill in the mountains and fight endless spawns of orcs for no real gain, but it might be more cool if a team had to get ore and got a reasonable reward for it. But I think the real impetus is the 'reasonable reward' and 'feeling like a faction' part, not the 'imaginary conflict that everyone knows won't happen' part. If conflict does come, that should be the ++ to it, not the sole reason.
IMHO.
While I love Iron Oligarch's idea, I think that Jayde's is far more feasible and would be more akin to an actual trade route.
I would be all in favor of seeing things like "A box/bag/crate of salmon" sold at Gaeseric's camp each with different weights and values to be bought by a merchant in the Docks/Zig. This could also work with corals and the like that could be bought on the other islands or found in appropriate quest areas.