This idea has been building for a week or two now ever since the death of Chell who was the high priest of the house of light which resulted in a very good bit of RP between his sister Danni and my character who is an acolyte within the house. Danni said that Chell had thought of leaving the house as it's mission was although noble not proactive enought for those following the path of Torm seeing how most of Torm's dogman centres round removing corruption and evil from the people whom the clergy and those connected to the church deal with. With all that happened with lower and the resulting slaughter of some Pc's and the tigereyes the idea has grown. As it stands I am thinking of having Jozan look into starting up an organization that would be based in upper simply for safety after all he saw in lower in his time with the house. This organization would be like a knightly order if you will (that was the idea Chell had been thinking of according to Danni) and would attempt to pick up where the house left off only with a more proactive view to helping the city not limited to healing and providing curing supplies for those who needed them. The purpose of this post is more to help build the idea than anything else on top of the IC stuff Jozan will be talking with people about. To get this off the ground the order will need a set of goals to achieve that can give the DM team something to work with as well as giving any who join the proposed order some intersting RP potential. Any idea's are welcome, and if you have either existing characters or new one's who would be intersted in joining this new order, if and when I can get it going, feel free to replay. I had this grand image of a King Arthur like order of Knights to begin with but thats a little restrictive but something along those lines is the idea. All going well maybe if the idea takes off with DM approval of course a chapter house can be set up somewhere in upper (Round table and all :D) so that the members can discuss whatever plans thay have and find ways to act on them.

But for now suggestions most welcome.

An order of 'knights' would be a practical counter-balance to the House in that they provide separate, yet related services. One acts as a police force of sorts in the name of good while the other facilitates hospitality, peace and medical aid.

Essentially the House would be for clerics and the Order would be for Lawful good fighters and paladins.

I see some good potential conflict between the House and the Order on the basis that while the House will aid ANYONE in need, the Order will not. I can see the paladins of the Order getting angry with Clerics of the House aiding evil people.

I think it is a good idea, but I've noticed that if you separate paladins from clerics, their numbers by themselves individually might not be able to sustain two separate groups, but if you combine them you have a sizeable number (as the House is right now).

Additionally, a group that actively fights evil kind of already exists with the Society of the Ordered Mind (though their main focus is the removal of abberations, still their quests can't be taken by evil folks).

And I know that my Paladin is definitely looking for a group that is more proactive in removing evil from Sanctuary.

i dont think clerics should not be allowed. some of the clerics, by thier deities' dogma should be a little more proactive in that manner. after all, clerics, as once i heard, are not a wand of healing :P .

and if we are already speaking, there should be a group of wizards aswell, aiding those knights. not the spellgaurd, though. they, too, need to be as pure as the paladins, clerics and knights.

you mentioned the round table, which sounds awesome, btw :) though they had merlin, do not forget... :D, i suggest, as we are not as slightly strong as merlin, have a group of wizards, aiding the knights with their knowldge, one wizard will be as a representitive of the group. he will be present in all meetings of the high ranks, and shall give orders to the fellow wizards. i was more thinking about mating a wizard with a knight, thus making them a good pair against many forces.

(raislin and his brother?)

The idea started as a knightly order but it would end up too much ;like the society. The plan has moved on to more of a united group of people of any class that would wish to make the city a better place by using what ever skills thay have, be that as warriors, healers or crazed fireball throwing wizards. The end product is intended to be an orgaization with no over all religious stand point or Dogma other than the disair to make thinks better (Neutral or Good aligned types). The general over view will have a ruling council of maybe 6 that plan the responce of the order to what happens in DM created events or simply from IC relationships. If you will the round table where all where equal so there is no leader. I just like the idea of a place where anyone who wishes to help can without having to be of a particular class so long as thay are trying to do good.

i think it should stay as knightly order, but, as been in dragonlance, already, a pair of a kight and a wizard is reasonable.

as long as its a knight, its ok. he can come as apriest, yes, but he is still a knight.dont bring a bard, and say he is a knight/wizard, for example.

If this is going to become some kind of evangelistic holy police force, expect it not to last long, but if not, its worth a try.

what i think Arminas-285 is trying to say is that it should be an order that will invite anyone in regardless of class and almost any alighnment (evil charecters of course being the ones not allowed) and since it isent soly based on religion there is no chance of it turning into an evangelical order

That's fine and all, I'm just saying, you go around tried to evangelize everyone by going like 'Oh thats evil dont be evil, go with torm!' Or whatever, expect to get some nasty reactions from a few people, and one nasty reaction can go a long way, before you know it, a member goes missing, etc.

Evil characters in organizations are a problem though. Right away no paladin could join the tigereyes, and being a paladin of mystra would be hard since most of the spellguard PC's are evil, so there goes any plan to enfore proper use of magic in sanctuary since vigilantes tend not to last long. Even the house had evil clerics in it worshipping the same gods as the paladins (which actully annoys me OOC but thats not the topic). The point of this order would be that it actully -IS- a chance to crusade for the paladin and lawful extreme clerics and good characters. Also sounds like it would work IC too "Hello counciler, me and my band of good knights and priests would like to take over law enforecment in place of the traiterous mercenarys who stormed up here and left a riot in lower"

Dilandau and Nero are on the right track with what i'm thinking but seeing as how i know them in the real world thats not too suprising. The idea is more along the lines of a group who wish to aid the city in whatever way possible, be that helping to defend the city in times of strife or by simply providing healing and protection to anyone who would need it. As i said its a Camalot mentality i'm thinking of. All are equal and the over all goal would be doing good and aiding the city. Any paladins and lawful god clerics could go out and crusade against evil as part of the order while more neutral types could simply be content to be healers and advisors if thay wished. The idea is not to be to stuck on one set of principles but to simple be a force for good within the city witjout being overly extream and forcing people into our way of thinking. The whole point is to make a group who can do many things to help and will offer each other a group protection and strenght in numbers for what ever task is at hand without labelling classes which the house did to an extent with regret. Paladins and fighter types will not be seen as guards but as fellow members in equal level just as clerics wont be expected to dish out healing to keep them alive. The whole point is an equality and fair order with the goal of helping all of the city not just part of it. The point of hopefully having it in upper is simply for security and because its closer to the town hall for meetings with councilers as well as the watch/spell guard/seekers/the Dwarven clan etc. -- but not pushing out whatever happens with the Tigereyes and lower. The idea of maybe taking over from the tigereyes is one possible route but maybe it would be better to stay neutral from the major factions, but its something to think about.

Why can't a paladin work for the Spellguard? The Order itself isn't evil, some of its members are.

By that logic, I'd think you'ld have to say a paladin can't even live in Sanctuary because citizens are evil; or work with the Council because some of its members are evil--they certainly can't join the Council or ever agree with its evil members. I personally tend to think a paladin can join an order with evil members, provided the group isn't evil and he actively works to reform or remove the evil and never idly sits by and watches it happen or supports it through indifference, fear, or inaction.

On a different note, I wouldn't let ANYBODY into a knightly order. Make a few guidelines; otherwise you don't have an "order" but a huge rabble that *could* start to look silly. I can think of past situations where people had a clan of half-orcs, but had members who were dwarves, elves, and even a gnome. Eventually, the group had no focus and fell apart.

In the knightly order I run already, people are required to have martial weapon proficiencies; they must wear armor; (because it is a militant order)-priests aren't allowed to join unless their diety is highly acceptable to the order's goals. Halflings and gnomes (midgets) aren't allowed to join. Even little things like that help keep an identity to the group.

I'd also pick a goal beyond "do good" that's almost too broad. The Society of the Ordered Mind "eliminates aberrations" while the Knighthood of Toboerski "supports an aristocracy and eliminates wererats". This helps you keep a very good idea how the group should respond to any situation; what interests them most, and gives DMs an idea of what hooks they can show your group if they get interested in it.

So, how does it feel to treat me like you do and lay your hands upon me and tell me who are you, anyway?

Bring back Ian Curtis.

i really think the house should survive, with a "little" add on: the order. the problem with the house was thier lack of millitary part. yes, they had paladin, for example, but that is just not enough or right. keeping the house (perhpas letting others join, such as monks, any one who can heal and aid), and boosting it with the millitary side of the order. yes, it shouldnt be a group who tells you do this, and do that, but rather a free group, to protect the house and perhaps the free speech of its follower, as long as its "good".

good will be defined by a group of the order, those of the "round table" :P

Trust me when I say that my paladin was quite active in trying to move the House to some form of proactive military action, but the ruling group of members wanted to solve things through peaceful means. And while my paladin believed in order and using laws to enforce that order, he did believe that sometimes knew that preventing evil through proaction was a way of keeping order, instead of reacting to chaos and trying to bring order to it.

However, most of those members are dead now, and seeing as many of the remaining members are paladins or divine fighters, I have a feeling that the House's goals will start to change as they are now forced to fight just to even continue to exist at all.

So I really do think that the House can become this 'new order' group.

well that will be stupid, letting go the concept of the house it shouldnt fall, may will revive it anyway, so the "house of light" is not a good name at all.

9lives wrote:

Bring back Ian Curtis.

Orcs...orcs will tear us apart again. :(

I'm named after that dude...

I guess I better chose my rope soon.

The idea of expanding the house of light is one option and is really the main focus of the idea as it started out. A while ago now many of the upper members of the house where discussing the idea of moving the house to upper for security reasons and this prompted the first thoughts in this new order plan. As it stands there may only be three or four members of the house still alive and i always felt the house was too focused on lower. Yes it's got problems but so does the rest of the city. The house of light isnt dead yet. (could be all cheesy and say as long as one of us still stands, we are legion) I'm not infavor of making a militery order but one with the goals of the house under a new banner situated in upper for the benifit of all Sanctuary. Not to sound daft but I never said before we would let anyone in, as with every faction there would be requirements to join the order so to limit the field of membership. What i'm not in favor of is saying things like "Your a rogue so we cant trust you but that clerics find because he's a cleric". The idea is a group who would focus on healing the wounds of the city, be that literally or by hunting down and destroying threats much as the society and the toberiski's do with aberations and wererats. So maybe the order could focus on another threat group like undead and necromantic magic's. This is more a way to have the house live on than to abandon it. Its a change of direction if you will from the old ways to a new improved House of light with a new name.

Suggestions of the Orders name are welcome as well mostly because my brain is asleep most of the time just now. Nothing daft if you will. And nothing that just sounds like a big sign flipping the underdark off and screaming at it for a fight. Something dignified that also sounds cool would be nice.

Back to the point though the membership would be decided by the council who would have to meet to discuss the merits of each applicant. (think the Jedi council in Episode 1 talking about young master Vader) The idea being that if one member of the council dosnt think a person is right for the order then thay cannot be part of it. The structure of that council i'm not sure of yet but the idea works if you have a mix of character types, such as below.

Paladins to sence any evil from a person Wizards/Sorcerers to assess the arcane powers if any controled by the subject Clerics to cover the religious aspects Other classes can cover any other area's as well as lending there personal experiance's to the councils decisions.

a. its anakin! :P

b. heh, actually that's part of what linda wanted to give the house, not axactly a council, but rather, everyone' voice is equal.

i think the council idea is great, with representitive of each type (notice that a scout, for example, can be a rogue, ranger, combination, or even a monk!)

as well as a force was thought to be built. though as an outer group. i think the house should be separated from the order, though the two groups should act together, (lets say, a man/woman of the house would be present at the council, though he/she only REPRESENTS the house, not a leader)

From IC actions that have taken place over the past couple of days i think i have found the mission that makes the most sence for any order that Jozan would want to set up. If this idea ever gets off the ground it will do everything the house of light did like offering healing to those who need it, safe and secure protection if required and with the new objective of hunting down and destroying undead. This all stems from doing the staircase quest the other night when before we went in a DM (not sure which one of the team it was, but still nice job with that cyrpt and bringing Merle back when i carried her out to the hold - cheers) triggered some kind of spell and opened up a tunel to a cyrpt filled with undead including some rather nasty Shadow fiends. Once that was done the party went into the staircase quest.... not the best idea ever. All the spells ran out and we lost Merle. Still got her out, had her raised and now my character hates undead like you wouldnt believe. I'm still looking for a possible name for the order, as well as toying with idea's as to setup within it. If anyone has idea's just stick them on even if you dont think your characters would want to be involved. Anythings welcome, hell even if you just want to help set it up to try and destroy it i'm game.

well, to call it a name related t okilling undead seems hard to me (right now, probably cause woke about 2 hours ago, and still unfocused) but perhpas a name shouldnt have to be undead related.

if any of you can call it by a name, perhaps "brotherhood of ____" thingy. if its suppose to be like the house, why not calling it "the new house"? or just the house.

if you say its suppose t obe like the house, only with a solid purpose, i cant see any reason why not even keeping the last name, "the house of light" perhaps "brotherhood of light", but you got the idea :D

Meh, I should read more of the forums then letters and journals so I would have seen this sooner.

From what I learned of the house (did not really get a lot of time before things started to go to hell) you should atleast keep something similair located in lower.

I saw it as a place of hope for the poor buggers stuck with nothing in lower and I do think you need to be located in lower to be so.

As for an order around it i'd love to see that, might even change my mind of not joining factions. :wink:

As it stands i think that the House of light is going to survive this seeing as how i ran into other members IC the other day... :D I aint the only one left. With time the hope is to rearrange the house slightly keeping its primery mission but having some of the suggestions and idea's being batted around on this link involved to make it work a little better.

If you want to create a succesor to the House of Light, who continue their work, call them "Keepers of the Light".

Has more than one meaning, if you think of it, which is usually a cool thing.

well, that ideas currntly:

house of light (original) brotherhood of light keepers of light (i think i like it as well :) )

i think the "house of light" should be the name of the place, while the "keepers of light" should be the name of the group.

brotherhood of light? imagin a female member of the brotherhood of light.

brothers and sisters in general = brothers..... :?

anyway, children of light? :D

Urg that sounds like a cult name :P

kinda sexist, sry its just we did this freakin massive unit on sexisem in Australia at school and i cant get it outta my head, some one pls... kill me...

Sanctuary's light and that is final!

The House of Light isn't dead. It just suffered many OOC and IC setbacks.

First, college and high school started up again in the US around the time of the war in Lower. So they haven't been playing as much in general.

Second, the House of Light had several of it's most well known PC's either die ICly or be retired by the player OOCly.

Third, we seem to have an above normal amount of new players on the server so finding the ones that are regularly one AND playing a paladin/cleric of a good diety had been hard.

The House does have a leader still, but he's just mysterious right now.

So I would really appreciate anyone who would be interested in this 'New Order' to come and try out the House for the moment. Things are changing and they are changing towards a more proactive group than before.

....least thats the goal anyway.

which may eventually leave (or wont obey to its leader's orders... :P )

EDIT:

This note is made by some OOC knowledge about the house ;)

You'd reckon that when you know may she mentions the house of light atleast once.... ;-)

one problem the house faced was that only paladins anc clerics can join its ranks. A holy order, where you simply need be a worshipper, can employ just about any class.

exactly, (im trying to put another invented name: "the order of light"), my monk could fit a religous group, and yet, there is no place for him. only as a gaurd. and this is just an example... im sure there are many other chars, and this lets us for more RP... there is finaly a place for "deity" window in the char creating ;)

Well of late i have sent a letter to Arthan IC from Jozan looking to discuss the next step for the house. What we can do as well perhaps (after the meeting actually happens) is look at calling for folk who would seek to join the house. Then we can rebuild the numbers as well as seeing to up dating the roster on the Forum (thats one for you Arthan seeing as you took over as moderator for it) but as was said it aint dead and we aint going without a fight. And as Nero said not just Paladins and Clerics, other classes would be nice as well. You dont have to be a holy warrior to want to help the city after all.

Yeah, I asked Arkov for moderator control since the others left for other servers or retired their characters.

I just can't get an accurate count of who all is part (or still wants to be a part of the house). Many of the members only play from time to time. OR if they are playing more regularly, then they aren't on during my normal play hours.

I have another character who's got a lot going on IG, so I'm really having a tough time balancing the two characters. But I'm trying to get Arthan back on track. I fact I think I've been able to develope a story for him that can hopefully put the House of Light back in the public eye again.

But I gotta run it past the DM's once we have a few members.

Sounds good. Let me know when you can get on with Arthan so we can IC discuss this and any other issues you have about the house.

I think recently the House has been handed a stigma that has come across to me from a number of different players, one that I think can be fairly easily remedied with some pro-active play. The House has suffered a lot of IC and OOC setbacks and in effect become an inconsequetial entity--that, from the last posts I think many can agree on. Adding to that fact was that many of the character either left, faded away, or were seen as a click while they were on. I'm not saying my opinion with or against these statement, these are simply the things that I have heard in game through tells and IRC conversations.

Personally I think the HoL has some great potential to go a lot of different ways if a player wants to really take charge and drive it. I do feel that such strict restrictions such as clerics and palladins only have led to a lot of the current HoL lack of support. I personally would like to see some changes made, and to see what could be a great organization survive.

or a load of guys at deacent lvls could just go kill the guys in the house.

that would be a comforting and inetersting thinking, but very narrow, compare to one who dont know exactly who is/was in the house and who doesnt... myself saw many who "disappeared", defently did not die, though

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doh my reply was like critical miss =X sorry, got exam tomorrow, guess that's why I didnt understand your reply =X

As far as NPC killing, its not that simple.

First, you can't grief NPC's without DM approval and supervision.

Second, they're probably stronger than you realize.

Third, the plot I'm working on doesn't require killing them at the moment.

Fourth, the last group who tried just that, were killed by reinforcements that arrived from outside. And no doubt, the House's bedrooms have reinforcements in them, so direct assualt could get messy fast.

Fifth, if you're not part of the house, does it really matter what happens to it?

:D