Well, I just posted this on the COA boards, and I'd like to see what feedback I can get here as well.

I was thinking recently, and something occurred to be that I think would make a little more sense, in terms of realism, concerning the effects of the spell Phantasmal Killer. Before I begin, I want to make it clear that I neither intend to whine about being killed by the spell (Though a character on my account played by someone else was a while back- and that is what set me thinking) nor do I really expect it to be implemented- after all I know what a headache even minor scripting can be. Really, I just want to get a feel for the general opinion. Anyway...

I see PhK as differing from the other, more 'common', death magics in that it kills through sheer terror (heart failure, mental overload etc.) rather that effectively rending a victim's soul from their living body a al Finger of Death. While I think instantaneous and complete death is fully reasonable with the latter vein of spells, I thought of an interesting way in which PhK could be handled differently.

First off I think that, as the spell causes a more 'mundane' death by its effects rather than actively killing it's target, I believe that the effects of the spell could be represented better by modifying it slightly. As opposed to an immediate trip to the fugue, I think reducing a target well into the negatives (-5 and bleeding, as an example), perhaps without the possibility of stabilising naturally, would create the deadly effects intended for the spell, while still offering the slight possibility of ordinary resuscitation that might reasonably be afforded under the circumstances.

While this altered spell is still quite nasty, and would cause untold havoc to a frontline even if it did not kill it's target, I think it offers the slight opportunity to be saved that I personally find fitting for a level 4 spell, especially considering the description of the spell itself, when set against the potency of insta-death effects normally reserved for spells of level 6+.

In any case, whether you like the idea or not, and reasonable comment would be appreciated.

Actually, the spell kills you because you *think* you are dead. It tricks your brain and is an illusion. Your mind shuts off, your soul departs your body--all because your mind and spirit think you died and do what they do naturally at that point--die.

hmm...i have been thinking.(bad thing :D) Is Phantasmal killer an evil spell? or is it just a spell like fireball etc. So if i'm playing a good char, example CG gnome, would his alignment allow him to use it?

My two cents.

Phantasmal Killer:

You create a phantasmal image of the most fearsome creature imaginable to the subject simply by forming the fears of the subject’s subconscious mind into something that its conscious mind can visualize: this most horrible beast. Only the spell’s subject can see the phantasmal killer. You see only a vague shape. The target first gets a Will save to recognize the image as unreal. If that save fails, the phantasm touches the subject, and the subject must succeed on a Fortitude save or die from fear. Even if the Fortitude save is successful, the subject takes 3d6 points of damage. (taken from d20 reference online)

The death is from illusory generated fear, and the person literally scared to death. In my opinion I would concur with Talueth that the person likely dies from heart failure, though think that instant death is a pretty good portral of what happens.

I don't think this spell is any more 'evil' than any other weapon or direct damage spell.

A spell that takes all your opponents worst fears and joins them into one embodiment that can scare them enough to cause death? That sounds pretty evil to me.

Phantasmal Killer

Despite the wonderful abstract ethical/moral dilemma arising from the employment of such a spell. Which could very well be discussed perennially without ever arriving at a satisfactory resolution...

By established rules of the game, it does not bear the "evil" descriptor, hence, it is not an "evil" spell.

A spell that takes all your opponents worst fears and joins them into one embodiment that can scare them enough to cause death? That sounds pretty evil to me."

It all depends on how it's used. Of course using it to slaughter children would indeed be evil. However, using it on the evil goblins to save the arch bishop of canterbury would be acceptable. What's the difference between using fear to kill them and a giant ball of flames? Both methods are rather cruel, while the sheer terror of phk is awful way to go, I'd imagine being burnt to a crisp by a fireball doesn't feel too good either.

I'm pretty sure Oroborous is correct.

I don't think it's anything to do with an embodiment of your worst fears. If it was, Paladins would get immunity to it.

Paladins are immune to it.

Cardiac arrest death can occur in a matter of few seconds if severe enough- often faster than death by less "mundane" effects. I just can't imagine someone having a severe heart attack and being saved by some sloppily applied medicinal herbs mid-battle.

It would seem it is up for debate whether that is how it kills, though.