Yes, that's right! From you, the player base!

<@DeputyCool> People frequently reference how fun it was in the early days of the server, when NPC's would randomly walk about, just to shoot the shit. <@DeputyCool> It was no uncommon to run into Yorrick, or Gaeseric, wandering through Upper. <@DeputyCool> What NPC's do people think this would be interesting with, in our contemporary setting? <@DeputyCool> I'm just curious to know what the equivilents are.

A lot of wonderful suggestions cropped up in IRC, but I didn't want to discount those people who weren't present. So please, let us know what you folks would like to see.

Just to reiterate my position.

More NPC's of flavor and depth. Just shooting the shit and existing, would add an infinite amount of feeling to the server, in my opinion. Be it sitting in the Last Stand getting a drink after a long hard day on the farm, or spreading gossip in the Grotto, just some things to make the server feel more "alive".

Granted, the notion of "DM PRESENCE = DM QUEST" would have to be addressed, and that notion crushed, but if it can be done, and DM NPCs could be possessed and exist without PC's seeking them and swarming for DM quests, I think it would be a huge boon.

Personally id like to see more npcs in Upper doing stuff. Such as.

1 Watchmen grumbling about how fecking filthy lowerman are and how the seekers are nothing but traitorus rats.

2 Npcs plopping up random quests out of the blue. (that may be for good or evil pcs.) Such as a paladin needing Help in New Dunwarren Etc.

3 Npcs in Lower showing off how anti upper they are.

4 Perhaps more random encounters in the underdark! To show how dangerouse it is. Drow Slavers Etc!

I might get publically flogged for suggesting this, but...

How about making NPCs move around like the Spellguard Law Enforcement animatron. They could spout various thoughts, opinions, or rumors.. maybe even recongize "wanded" Factions.

" Boo! You suck Seekers! " ;)

As far as NPCs, I think it would be interesting to see some of the normally static NPC's out and about. Bilby, Norma, the Old Woman by the Cart ( move that damn thing already!).

I nuture a deep hatred for anything that speaks automatically.

>_> <_<

Sir Gimmins Gimminity! >_> <_<

Otherwise, I agree with RwG's post.

A minor crisis can go a long way to getting people to work together, or at least parallel. It doesn't always have to be the major baddies, illithid, drow, what have you. Let's have a group of NPC bandits attack by sneaking in instead of charging, or a prolonged siege against some goblins. Even if its been done before, it's good.

glorblor

Please have the beggers/citizens NPCs right say more stuff about recent things and go into a bit more detail "Oh I saw The Prince take down five people other dark! Shit me!" that was a poor example but stuff like that and update their conversation tables at least once a week.

Also what about getting more travellers (NPC) pass through selling wares, looking for jobs etc etc, PCs cant be the only escaped slaves right?

EDIT : I also strongly agree with RwG, good thinking!

derflaro glorblor

Yes!

I'd say having Prominent NPCs walk around and interact with people would be cool/interesting, and definitely a good idea if a DM is bored/not running anything.

Then again... the days of Gaeseric/Ronus/Bhast aren't so common and I cant think of too many awesome NPCs that I'd interact with right off the bat.

... So, make some! ^^

Yes...

Stop killing all of them.

(lol)

I agree we could use some more prominent NPC's.

Herald Jafar's pie eating contest.

D&D, that is a wonderful idea. Absolutely uber. Now why didn't you think of it before Ulgar died!!!

There are many NPCs who just don't do things. The shift in focus from almost NPC factions and plots and story to almost purely PC driven everything honestly sucked the life right out of EfU in that regard. NPCs use to have goals, agendas, and they would push and pull the PCs as they pursued their goals and agendas.

Then, many of these NPCs died or disappeared from Bhast and Yorrick to Gaeseric and Etorix. Some PCs managed to maintain lively and interesting events quite clearly, but the loss of these NPC agendas made the world feel like all that mattered were players and that the NPCs were nothing but rather dull backdrops rather than vibrant stories waiting to be discovered, challenged, or incorporated into your own.

I'd not just like to see Etorix wander the streets and occasionally sneeze and chat it up, but actively hire PCs to do stuff for him. Act like he's got an actual agenda beyond building statues everyplace that the local inhabitants will let him. Whatever happened to Gaeseric? Shouldn't people encounter a mysterious man out in the wilderness sometimes with his silent homo-erotic companion?

The "new" NPCs like the Hoaran chick who was a Councilor, and the new Grumbar devote who sits and kneels in Townhall--these NPCs never ever had any life or substance to them. They were flat, one-dimensional rather than even two dimensional figures. I doubt 90% of the players even know their names or what they're really about. I figure, the fact I can't think of their names for the life of me says something about how flat they fell for me as a player.

I'd love to see "new" NPCs that took the spot-light of some of the fallen ones and did something with it. It was exciting to watch Azzam really do something after such a lenghty period of NPC death or stagnation--and then Azzam stagnated with his girlfriend (which, I suspect may have been a very exciting story/plot for some to pursue) but again nothing rose to fill in that void of a story-driven server.

There is much to be said about a player-driven server. Yet, why bother with DMs if the whole project is player-driven? DMs are not, in my mind, just here to run occasional quests or help out player ideas. They really are here as Storytellers who should be knocking our socks off with their creative ideas.

Instead, and I'll be blunt, some DMs are playing characters and getting all their creative juices out as players with the advantages of DMs (knowing the server, knowing the players, the subtle stuff--none of the blatant unethical stuff like free perks or anything). If they're DMs, I'd love to see some of that energy really go into NPCs and DM stories that affect players and the server too. Hopefully, that's not too blunt or comes across negatively--but it is something I've got the feeling isn't 100% inaccurate even if I lack the full picture of what goes on behind the DM curtain.

Lovely words, I totally agree.

I've commented on these exact things, but I'll redo the spirit of them. I agree with Oro that the DMs COULD do more storytelling/shaping. Helping PCs achieve goals is awesome and appreciated. Just a request for more of the other stuff, time willing.

1. PCs recruit like hell, why not NPCs? Cyrus asking a big fighter to work as a bouncer, or putting up noticed that he wants a....manager. Armand Walters walking around Old Sanctuary looking for "a few good men". Awesome stuff i'd say.

2. PCs hire people to do jobs or go on quests with them, why not NPCs? And for that matter, PCs in factions used to hire random adventurers ALL THE TIME when I first started playing here. Now, it's much more cliquey and secretive.

NPCs I'd like to see possesed randomly to RP, recruit or hire: Azzam Grumbarite clerics Sugriam, Norma, Hans, Jordian Armand Waters Rak the Innkeeper Cyrus ANYONE in the gambling hall NPC Spellguard Agents NPC Watch members Bilby Winston Jonathan Redd Macasta The shitload of New Dunwarren NPCs Harrison Anvilkine Wally the Dock builder The halfling Seeress in the Canal Ward ANYONE in the Sultry Siren The priestess in the Ibrundalite shrine

3. Finally, I like the "us against them" theme better where the squabbling and foolish people of Sanctuary are repeatedly forced to band together or risk extinction. Maybe the Montezzis now have to deal with an external threat, and the people of Lower see them as their saviors?

MUCH more epic stuff. Even fighting the goblins of the Canal Ward.

Good to see the DM's looking for input! Awesome!

More conflict between NPC factions, IMO. Don't just wait for PCs to join, some factions are PCless. Cool factions like Kenning and Macasta disappeared after the PCs were gone. Maybe make bars fight against each other, or Cyrus trying to steal goods that Kenning is importing, or from the Jumping Jim Dandy person. Personally, I liked the time when there was a small DM event or DM sponsored arena almost every night, because it was something cool to do, even if it was not plot heavy. I think Oro hit it on the head though.

I haven't seen a bad idea posted in this section yet, this would be a great thing to see happening again. There is not much I can add but my aproval and a few NPC's to start with. Shop owners, Inn owners, Cyrus, Rak and all the others out there. I don't think its unusual for a owner to sometimes chat it up with his patrons. There are often a lot of PC's hanging around these places to begin with, which gets the most bang for the buck.

Something as simple as, "How are you all doing, today? So what do you think about this *blank*?" can go a -long- way to making the NPC's "come alive" and make the player base feel as though they are -real- people, with depth and all that good stuff we love about efu NPC's! If PC's assume you have a quest for them and you tell them you don't, either rudely or kindly or however depending on the NPC in question, you still accomplish the goal of giving them a personality. As a player I love this. I also want to add, its ok to have powerful, influential NPC's. As a player I don't tend to see them as vaulting past all the obstacles I have to get into influential positions, instead I see them as people who I can interact with who will help me reach my own goals (or be anopther challange to overcome). This is a game of allies and of conflicts, NPC's should be part of the equation.

I imagine as DM, I would love this too, chooseing or building some NPC's to call my own and then bringing them alive for the players to interact with. It's a win-win, which is a rare enough circustance in the universe that we must take advantage. Am I right?

About a year ago, during my first playing session here, I went on a quest which remains among my top 5 funniest during my whole EfU experience...This was a delivery quest by Rak to the Blue Mushroom, and it took about 30 minutes with no complications.

The thing that made it awesome was how it was non-static. A quest you would never do again, and that probably nobody else got to experience. That sort of thing is awesome, no matter what the reward or challenge is.

WORD Gwydion. Good thoughts there.

If I had to make a shorter list of NPCs I'd like to see, they would be...

Azzam Norma & Hans (love renewed!) Armand Waters Cyrus NPC Spellguard Agents , Barkley/K. Miller NPC Watch members/Blackbeard Winston Jonathan Redd Macasta One or two NOTABLE New Dunwarren NPCs Harrison & Anvilkine, trying to mess with each other's business and hiring adventurers. Great low-level sort of DM quest to run! ANYONE in the Sultry Siren - There's a lot of potential in this building, but it's still a huge mystery to everyone so far as I know. Flesh it out some! The priestess in the Ibrundalite shrine - Everyone else notable is dead, it's her time to shine!

I agree almost completely with Oro.

I think the DMs are doing a great job already, and I'm not really nagging on any of you, or intend to. I just think back in the "Old" days there used to be a lot more interesting NPCs. Many of these have been ditched and left to grow stagnant so that PCs could take over, which isn't neccesarily a bad thing, but it can be if the PCs expected to take over are doing a worse job or non-existant.

Just my two cents!

In my less lucid moments of dreaming "If I were a DM what would I do on EFU", this is exactly the kind of stuff I thought about. Some DMs dig their faction stuff, other rpefer quests, others are scripters, some jump around, but relatively few have been just making random possessions in what play time I've had recently. I like the idea of a roving DM presence who just flits about adding little bits of flavor - rockfalls endangering people int the underdark, spooky noises, drow patrols to be avoided or interacted with NOT just killed, etc. Similarly in town this is somewhat lacking as well. I agree that just scripting random actions and emotes from NPCs would tiresomely clog the message window, but to have meaningful DM possession would be really cool.

About a year ago, during my first playing session here, I went on a quest which remains among my top 5 funniest during my whole EfU experience...This was a delivery quest by Rak to the Blue Mushroom, and it took about 30 minutes with no complications.

The thing that made it awesome was how it was non-static. A quest you would never do again, and that probably nobody else got to experience. That sort of thing is awesome, no matter what the reward or challenge is.

: D

I would like to see:

Cyrus takes a day off: Cyrus returns to his infamous criminal days and highers some adventures to do some dirty work for him.

The guy in black armor at the bottom of the lift leading out of New Dunwarren? Who the hell is this guy, and why the hell does he just stand there doing absolutely nothing with some gang members? I would like to see him do something. I bet he's freaking awesome in some way.

The Thomas Parade Thomas for giggles decides to have an undead parade or party. Where people interested in the undead can learn some things. Really get know why Shades, Allips, Shadows, Ghouls, and Vampires are what they are, and what fuels them to stick around and torment others.

Baron Maxwell von Matterhiem Gone!? Matterhiem nurses have lost their dear Maxxie Baby, who on earth will ever find him? It sounds hilarious. What if he decided just to get up one day and go for a walk.

The Chosen play in Lower Brings the big rats back and give them a frontman we can't kill and will never forget.

Ibrandul Who????? The god is dead and so is this shrine. Ibrandul (Shar) should be huge down in Lower right now. There is more suffering and secrecy then ever before. Priestesses and Priest should be wandering all over Lower preaching.

Sewertown food raids Lets get some of the leaders down there raiding Lower, Canal Ward, and Upper for something other then rat meat.

Lord Bunge, gets a finds treasure??? Its been a long time coming, but Lord Bunge tribe should score something big.

The Grotto... What's this place for? Maybe something happened here in the past, but I have no idea who, what, when, where, and how this place is in existance.

Vampires, Werewolves, and Mummies! Oh My!! In the past these most villianous monsters played a large role in Sanctuary fear. Let's bring the fear back, pretty please!!!

There are numerous things that could happen that would impact the player thought process greatly. Instead of power playing take over Sanctuary mentally. It would produce truly unique PCs, that would stick around into retirement, and not fear being FD.

What about say a merchant from Mur or some settlement or other that wanders through town and shacks up in the marketplace for a spell, selling strange goods and maybe coming into conflict with a PC that he thinks might have stolen from him or a watchman that is hasting him because of his lack of license or hiring some PCs to guard his stall or escort him back to his settlement. All good fun that your random PC can get in on and get some of that fabled DM loot for a price.

Gwydion The priestess in the Ibrundalite shrine

Garem The priestess in the Ibrundalite shrine - Everyone else notable is dead, it's her time to shine!

dead-bunny Ibrandul Who????? The god is dead and so is this shrine. Ibrandul (Shar) should be huge down in Lower right now. There is more suffering and secrecy then ever before. Priestesses and Priest should be wandering all over Lower preaching.

You know, I had kept asking for days in IRC when apperently there was some kind of DM dry spot for a Delina possession for my IBRADUNLITE shrine priestess to get some IC/OOC idea about the workings of the place and the back door (and a Ibrandul helm so my Miss Sensitive-eyed priestess wouldn't look as silly with a robe and a not-as-sleek helmet on all the time as I couldn't seem to find one that wasn't =/). Needless to say I got simply sick of waiting for something that would take 5-10 minutes and DEAD went my use of the character being completely burned out after this and another incident, which I will not mention. Most of the time she just hung out at the shrine RPing with people running errands and explored the Underdark.

I humbly apologize for burning out on this character so you couldn't get your fix of Ibrandul. I may be playing this character once again due to this demand.

Seeker NPCs in the wild of the Underdark doing their thing.

More forum wars between NPCs.

Mur Traders coming to town. I believe trade is extensive...also Shadow Tribe Merchants!

Well I mentioned this on Irc a few weeks ago but ill bring it back up here. During elections have NPC's that are running put out fliers and maybe give speaches so PC's actualy know what they are standing for.

Also whilst in the council ive noticed that often NPC's just say yes or no to proposals without really giving a reason why which can be frustrating since its hard to change there minds if you dont know why they are for or against something.

Also as a good tip.

NPC possession is most hawt when its background noise to what the PCs happen to be doing, something that seems totally natural. Say Macasta arguing with Rak over some small budget issue in the last month. I mean, it doesn't have to be detailed, just hint towards the reasons.

The smallest things are the coolest. Say having a rat squeak and dive into a trash-pile; Two guards chatting in whispers by the front gate; Hear an indistinct argument from the windows of a house you are passing; Have a commoner light up a smoke (or pay someone to go run and collect them a pack from the grotto); etc...

Religion becoming more prevalent and important. I don't believe that a PC can do this, because a cleric is just another class, and killable. Religion ought to survive the death of its priests, I would like to see it be a heavier influence in the server (though I'm not sure how this could be done).

I must say, Kudos to whichever DM possessed the Spellguard Watchman animatron, that was a real sweet moment.

And yes, I am of the opinion that random possession makes -alot- of difference in the rp feel of the server... It doesn't even have to be large things or conversations, just to see a commoner walk into the Stand or Crone for a drink or the like.

Kaelle Religion becoming more prevalent and important. I don't believe that a PC can do this, because a cleric is just another class, and killable. Religion ought to survive the death of its priests, I would like to see it be a heavier influence in the server (though I'm not sure how this could be done).

Perhaps simply making it clear where people are going to hear sermons and mass. Is the Hold maintaining a strong following, is Ibrandul losing worshippers to Ascension cultists? That kind of stuff could go into a general monthly rumor post detailing the state of Sanctuary.

Ala these. Link

Kaelle Religion becoming more prevalent and important. I don't believe that a PC can do this, because a cleric is just another class, and killable. Religion ought to survive the death of its priests, I would like to see it be a heavier influence in the server (though I'm not sure how this could be done).

I'd like to see this also. FR is such a religious-centric setting. Sanctuary needs more little shrines and irritating proselytizers and such.

Animatron possessions rock, although I think that it's becoming a bit too popular. I've seen at least six of them today and yesterday, and have only seen one other possession (which really was pretty awesome).

I'm excited about all this, when I finally get another character going, I think it'll be a lot of fun. One suggestion I wanted to add...

For anyone in any faction, its fun to get to know your superiors. It's also fun when these superiors have distinctly different ways of going about their bussiness. Historically, ya'll have been pretty good at this, so I guess this is more of a keep it up deal then otherwise. I don't want to pretend to know, but I think the seekers could use some more npc leadership along these lines. Feels like there has been a bit of a void ever since Ivy bit the dust.

WARNING - BIG POST

I thought a bit about how my perception changed and I tried to write a few points that I thought created Depth into the game-world...

One thing I'd point out is NPC support, Whether it is NPC supporting PCs or NPCs supporting/fighting other NPCs.

- Shadowshield Spellguard Agent dropping from invis.. and then invis'ing away (for lack of a better 'word') established a -fear- that you were really NEVER sure a -hit-, -crime- or whatever in upper sanctuary would be interrupted by these high-level badasses.

Bhast died around the time he refused to have the help of thes guys... Might say it is something to follow IG- but yes, just keeping the idea that an invisible Spellguard Agent with Shadowshield is lurking around.. in Upper Sanctuary puts fear in trying assassination in the district and on -any- big NPCs or PCs, in fact.

I liked NPC-support a lot, it gave a bigger depth to PCs and scared people more in trying to take them out because they were supported by X and X super-powers and you didn't want to offend these super-powers... It gave a new layer of influence... different from mechanical power. Examples?

- Baldev and the Great Shadow Death, You didn't want to attack him because there might be a chance that the Great Shadow Death be offended and ask for your head. The last few ambassadors that appeared... seemed to receive very little support from their leader either having Kobold butlers, bodyguards or help from the Great Shadow Death itself.

- Frum and ... hidden dude... when some people tried to take out Frum, something bad happened. Frum was extremely weak mechanically, but the NPCs that supported him gave him... some fear because you didn't know what their response would be.

- I remember Fawkes as being the guy acting as the intermediary for Bhast, and it was -kick-ass- to see, it gave fear because it seemed (even if he really wasnt) that Bhast would protect Fawkes and vice-versa. I really enjoyed seeing that relationship, even from afar.

- Wilks gaining the favor of the Red-smiles and having these NPCs help him out in the rebellion against the tiger-eyes... The mutiny.. etc..

- Suicide Bombers during the lower-chaos... Yet, we never saw -one- suicide bomber yet, and what happened to lower is pretty more hardcore. <_<

- During the take-over of the Canal-ward, most NPCs just followed the orders of the PCs and it ended up in a staring match with a few.. daring to attack. If some hardcore NPCs would have went suicide- bombed, etc...Or nervous Watch NPCs just making mistake and rushing into lower.. creating a huge fiasco. Leaving everything in the hands of PCs is fine, but having NPCs act out creates an unpredictability in victory or the event which is ... interesting!

I would say same with factions-- having NPC Watch, like a rugged veteran showing up to help out his mates in trouble (during PvP.. during missions... during speech or whatever), showing that the PCs have the support of the faction! - It just makes it more kickass for the PCs in that faction.

Seekers receiving help from other scouts or information from seeker-spies, etc if they are well liked in the faction... like a Seeker spy relaying information for them about something they heard... bad-dudes in the city say or do... Rumors being spread by these NPCs.. "Oh, I heard that Agrael Lothor acquired a Magic-chance ball, etc... I say him use it during XXX" .. Unpredictability.

Same with Spellguard receiving the backup of animatrons or other agents during certain situations...

Fear of the unknown is somewhat missing, everything in the city (NPC-wise and PC-wise) seems sort-of easy to kill or predictable in their response except for a few big names.

It's not totally gone, as Aleczumberzeil did have an entire army of Undead at his disposal, and it did give him a certain unpredictability, yet he's pretty much the only recent example that I can think of.

Most NPCs do not seem to wish to intervene in PC conflict and have a layed back attitude of solve it yourself. I find. Having these NPCs take side and making people strive to not gain mechanical power... but political power is -extremely- interesting.

I understand this non-intervention of NPCs is to make sure everything is fair and even-sided for everyone, but I believe it removed an interesting aspect of power...

Mechanical power is extremely predictable, but political power is not, hence it brings an "unknown" or "fear" factor back into the play.

...i.e. Helping out Gaesaric and Gaesaric tells you he will help you out in the future. Now you are no longer bob the merchant, you are bob the merchant under the protection of Gaesaric the bad-ass. Nina Sikara hiring people out of the blue to lay an ambush on PCs she has been hunting for crime X.

A long time ago, I remember a group of people going to slay the fledgling shadow-tribe upnorth as part of a DM quest, we did it. No survivors, the tribe got rebuild, and I was shit-scared that Etorix would try to find out who did it and send assassins or himself after us... nothing happened but a NPC-reaction would have been expected and normal, and I feel that this reaction is somewhat missing to people who are supported by NPCs at the moment.

...Maybe it is simply my perception that changed and there -never- were any NPC support in the form that I am talking about and I simply believed there was because I was new, but still- maybe I'm not!

I agree with Mort. Under the glorious reign of Dan, everything will improve and your lives more bountiful.

Support the revolution. It's better here.

(No, really. You guys are raising awesome points.)

The problem with that Mort, is that having a dragon appear and kill everyone in your party with one hit because the PC shadow tribe ambassador thought he was being looked at impolitely five months ago from across the screen, would be quite a downer.

Hugely exxagerated for the sake of argument. :!:

Kaelle The problem with that Mort, is that having a dragon appear and kill everyone in your party with one hit because the PC shadow tribe ambassador thought he was being looked at impolitely five months ago from across the screen, would be quite a downer.

Hugely exxagerated for the sake of argument. :!:

The problem with that is hyperbole.

What you suggest Kaelle would never happen and would be silly if it did.

What mort is pointing out is stuff that happened more once upon a time, and never seemed silly.

A healthy middle ground is definitely something I'd like to see, on the topic of NPC support. Perhaps not dragons getting behind a concept, but rather, some kobolds, or maybe some gnoll bandits. A few lone duergar scavengers, or even a drow mercenary or two.

Scratch that, definitely not dragons. Some things are far too powerful to be directly seeking the revenge of a PC for, though that's just my style of storytelling and balancing here.

I am a big fan of NPCs employing, manipulating and supporting PCs. A particular moment of awe was when Fryar finally slew Baldev Cole and lead the Armies of Sanctuary to destroy Sslal'teesh, Etorix descended in rage upon Sanctuary and demanded Fryar surrender himself. It was a poignant moment, and suitably epic. I think these things take care, and panache to pull off meaningfully.

Sherry and I differ upon our opinions of how things work, and I think that's part of the strength of the DM Team- the discussion and debate helps us refine our ideas, and prevent our greater flights of fantasy from ruining the integrity of the server. A healthy middle ground is always best!

Why do PC's even need the support of uber NPC's such as Etorix? Such things, of course, are always awesome if done well but there are other ways to be equally awesome without unbalancing the scales of power.

For example: Let's say a priest shows up in the city and is attempting to get everyone to worship his deity. The priest delivers speeches, sermons and actively seeks to convert PC's. What is wrong with having two or three commoners dressed in simple robes standing in the street of Upper Sanctuary displaying that they have been "converted" by the PC's words on the next module update? Little touches like that could go a long way toward making the server more alive and dynamic without really giving a PC a tangible boost in power.