Home > DM Questions & Answers

Remuneration in NWN and DnD

Its been argued before, and after a large discussion of it in IRC some people asked me to post it as a suggestion--but I know the response the suggestion always gets from a minority base of players, so I'm just asking for DM response-hence the post is here.

In DnD you get points for killing things. In NWN you only get points for killing things. There is no way to obtain high level, gold, or items after a certain point short of killing things. This is why many people favor hack and slash roll-playing.

EfU is a roleplaying server. Yet, EfU and many PWs I've enjoyed still reward predominantly hack-and-slash.

There is the argument that DMs reward roleplaying, good solid roleplaying very well with unique items, boosts of XP, fun and intriguing plots, special storylines. This is not undeniable, although I doubt anyone disagrees when I say it still isn't done as often as it should be. DMs only have so much time, and it is a game--not your job to reward players no matter how much you may also enjoy that.

All of this aside, DnD is also inherently a system where levels and gold matter. In the real world, an influential and well spoken man, with vast riches will accomplish a great deal. In DnD, this is also true.

Yet in DnD, the only way to become rich and well spoken is to gain levels and kill things for their gold. No matter how well you roleplay, a level 10 cleric buffed with maxed persuade still will have more ability to persuade audiences than your level 2 bard. No matter how influential you are in the city, sitting on the Council; former Sheriff of the Watch; hero who saved the city from Bub the Blustery--you still only have as much gold as you earn from questing. No reward of land ownership off which you secure a steady income through rents, no ability to invest in bonds, draw interest off your bank account (quite the opposite actually), et cetera.

Thirdly, EfU has a lovely system for tracking XP and wealth. I'm quite certain that if each DM drew up a list of their favorite three characters, the ones that have the most impact on the server, are the most influential, make the stories the most intriguing *and* they look at the system to see which ten characters have the most gold and which ten have the most XP that there will not be 100% agreement between these two lists.

Because like it or not, some players are just better at questing and others are better at telling stories. Yet, I think I firmly established that levels and gear are also rewards. Just like plots, DM attention are rewards.

I think that the server can do a better job at gearing all its rewards to roleplaying even if it appears that some rewards gear better towards roll-playing.

All it takes is for the DMs to periodically toss out a list of their three or five, or just one favorite character and see if that character is on the list of top ten XP or gold holders and if they aren't let them get a boost up there. Its a case I know where people get to have their cake and eat it too, but it is also a case of making rewards consistent. Levels and gold may not matter fully or more than story, but they are still rewards that count. I'm merely proposing a clear way to ensure that the rewards for roleplaying are both the same as those you can get rollplaying, better than those you can get rollplaying, and that rollplaying won't ever get you something you can't also get roleplaying.

Also realize this isn't just for the good roleplayer. It wouldn't make sense for a character who portrays a low life thug, always down on his luck and poor to be high level and rich at all. I can think of guys like Dale (DruQks can explain!) there.

This is mostly for those guys who sit on the Council, run their own organized and effective (key words) factions, exert vast influence and control and initiative in DM factions, the guys who had they been NPCs would have been high level NPCs.

So I'd like to know if the DMs see it like this, and are planning on really taking advantage of Strife's excellent work with EFUSL which makes this truly and absolutely possible. If you look at the EFUSL and notice that the highest level character on the server, with the most gold sitting in the bank, and the most valuable collection of gear (the later may not yet be tracked, but I'm sure you could track the value of someone's gear) and you realize that they aren't your most impactful characters on the server, then you believe its fair, possible, and in fact extremely worthwhile to foster the kind of roleplay environment EfU is based on to ensure that the person at the top in any manner of reward scheme are the players who do the most not those who quested the most.

Afterall, if a PC can obtain the influence of Starag, they should have the levels Starag had. If they wield the impact that Bhast has, they should have the money Bhast has.

I missed part of the discussion last night that I think had a lot of bearing.

There is more RISK to things like joining the Council than simply questing. Yet joining the Council will not get you to high levels (rewards are rewards, I may prefer twinkies to doughnuts but I still like to have both), and yet questing will get you to high levels and large amounts of gold.

If you're good at questing, you know mechanics, there is really very little risk in questing.

If you're good at questing, you know mechanics, and join the Council--statistically speaking you're dead meat within three months with the single exception of Geigne (who we all know Jake Whisker ate, and pretended got to the surface). Yet despite the clearly higher risk in surviving on the Council, Councilors have less gold and less xp than most other players.

They also do a lot of forum work. Forum work, it bites. Yet we all know the server is improved by it; its why DMs concientiously do it.

Many key NPCs are low level.

If a character dies regularly, no matter how much DM XP they get it they won't stay at high level.

I can't honestly think of many characters that I feel either have too much XP/too little XP.

I appreciate the post though. I'm very tired at the moment of posting, but it's good to think about how EfU rewards its players.