I like the way summoning can be controlled in EFu with entire sets of creatures that override the standard summons.

And the way it is should stay for wizards/sorcerors.

I think though for druids & clerics they should be defined by other things.

Druids probably by alignment.. The TN, CN and LN would probably just have an animal set. NE will have a different one, and NG another different one (or specific changes)

Clerics should be defined by domains somehow. Maybe some item in your inventory you select to CHOOSE which domain you want to be summoning from.

I know a particular cleric of kossuth that would love to summon fire based creatures. (no I dont play him)

This is a lot of work with some table I know but it's extremely flavourful, and I can already hear people screaming again how clerics are getting too much love ;) Remember though that EACH of these sets are usable by wizard/sorcerors when they get the appropriate TOME (or conjuring component) Wizards and sorcerors get to pick and choose based on the job (or time of day or whatever)

Clerics only get to choose between 2 and thats it ever. Druids get a set based on their alignment and thats it ever.

Ok here's the basic idea, i've put in the current expanded domains list to give a basic idea of the set associated:

NE druids: Evil aligned Beasts of the underdark (minor malar's etc)

N, LN, CN druids : Normal underdark animals (rothe, rats)

NG druids : Good aligned animals/beasts of the underdark

Chaos Domain: List of chaotic neutral aligned outsiders or underdark creatures.

Luck Domain : Does not have a summoning list. (use default)

Law Domain : List of Lawful Neutral Aligned outsiders or underdark creatures.

Ooze Domain : List of slimes, jellies etc.

Cavern Domain : (same as druid neutral animal list or special list with dragazhar, lurkers etc) Darkness Domain : List of shadow plane (shadowshield effect) creatures

Hatred Domain : Hook horrors, aberrations (eyeball)

Metal Domain : List of metallic constructs.

Portal Domain : List of outsiders of unusual type.

Spider Domain : List of spiders of various types + ettercaps.

Drow Domain : (same as spider)

Orc Domain : List of Pigs, Orcs, Orogs of various persuasions/classes.

Dwarf Domain : Minor Earth Creatures, Avatar Dwarves of various dwarven deities (battlerager, clerics etc)

Elf Domain : (same as good druid list)

Halfling Domain : Avatars of various halfling deities.

Gnome Domain : Avatars of various gnome deities.

Illusion Domain : Illusionary versions of other creatures (ghostly visage display)

Spells Domain : does not have a specific summoning list use default.

Reptilian Domain : Lizardmen, Trogs, Kobolds, Reptiles

Undeath Domain : Undead list

Sea Caves Domain: Underwater Creatures, Sea Hag, Water elemetals Fungus Domain : Stationary Violet Fungi, Yellow Mold, Underdark Mushrooms, Minor Trolls, Avatar of psilopyr

Standard Domains

Air: Air elementals, air based creatures Animal: Same as Druid neutral animal list above. Death: Various ability avatars (all appear as the display specific to the deity) Destruction: Demons of Various sorts. Earth: Earth elementals, mephits , earth dwelling creatures Evil: Evil aligned outsiders or Druid -evil animal list. Fire: Fire elementals, mephits, Azer , fire dwelling creatures Good: Good aligned outsiders or druid-good animal list. Healing: No summon list, use default Knowledge: No summon list use default Magic: no summon list use default Plant: Various barkskin covered creatures (often stationary with range powers or slow moving + tough) Protection: no summon list use default Strength: no summon list use default Sun: Light based creatures, deal positive energy damage, some at range, (white glow invisibility effect) Travel: no summon list use default Trickery: no summon list use default War: Random warriors pulled off other battlegrounds temporarily. (2-weapon beserkers, 2-hander warriors, knights with shield, archers) Water: Water elementals, or same as SEA CAVES domain.

Doing this was originally discussed, and the fear was that a summoning set this wide would actually bloat the module to disgusting proportions.

Instead, when I did most the themes I stuck to a few important ones the DMs requested. Many of the blue prints for the expanded themes you mention actually do exist though on my hard drive in various levels of completion.

I've been contemplating putting them together and releasing them on the Vault someday; but laziness...damn that laziness.

How much space would each theme take then?

How much do the current themes that are in take up?

What is in right now is somewhere between 500 kb and 1000 kb I'd imagine. I'm not sure what the actual size of the module is in bytes though.

The way to look at it though is that there is a limit to the number of files that can exist in a module. Each summon theme tends to create 9 new files for the module, and that's a much better way to look at it. So the big question is how many more files can go into the module, and what percent of that would the DMs want to fill with unique summon themes.

The module is up around 60MB now, and always growing. We've made a lot of decisions on things here and there to keep it down. If we didn't clean things out and make decisions not to add things, I could easily envision us being over 100MB at this point.